Bully victims need to let it go

[Sci-Fi]

So to stop a bully you must become a bully? Sorry I don't agree with that, you can stand up to someone without getting physical.

 

[Spy]

No. Not becoming a bully but defending yourself. Always be the defender and not the attacker.

I'm against violence but every time I didn't do anything to defend myself I was bullied more because the bullies thought it's fun to harass a kid who doesn't do anything to defend. It's an easy job.

But each time I defend and counter-attack the bully, they stepped back and it may them think again that: watch out, he's unpredictible and can make me look like a fool.

 

[ardour]

So to stop a bully you must become a bully? Sorry I don't agree with that, you can stand up to someone without getting physical.

Self-defence isn't bullying. Sometimes hitting back is the only answer. "Just ignore it" or "walk away" seems like good advice... right up until you're being hit in the back of the head or kicked on the ground.

 

[Cucuboth]

Bullying is abusive behaviour. I think it should stop being called 'bullying', and be called what it is. Abuse.

Fighting, hitting people, doesn't always work. I tried to, several times, as a teenager defend myself, and it only made it worse, because then they knew they could get a reaction out of me. So they just went in harder, and laughed more each time I tried to make someone stop.

And sometimes it's hard to let go, because, even 20 years later when you run in to them out somewhere, even though they might be with their kids, they immediately launch in to the same lines and jokes at you. Sometimes it's there even now, from total strangers, when we just go down to the store, or even just for a walk.

Oh, and I don't buy in to that old clap-trap about how they must be unhappy themselves. It's pretty much all about power, control, and popularity.

 

[Spy]

Oh, and I don't buy in to that old clap-trap about how they must be unhappy themselves. It's pretty much all about power, control, and popularity.

I'm with you 100% with this statement Cucuboth.

 

[Goblin]

An adult, perhaps, can ignore bullying (the question is, should someone just trying to earn a living at work be expected to tolerate such an environment?).

A child who's still learning basic responsibilities, interpersonal skills, and life skills, and isn't considered mature enough to drive, vote, have sex, own property, have a job, or drink, though? What's a 6-year-old who's not allowed to do any of those things because it's too much for them to handle to do when other children are ganging up on them, excluding them, insulting them, stealing from them, spitting on them, stalking them, spreading rumors about them, or trying to physically harm them? What's an 11-year-old to do?

Try to hang themselves, apparently.

 

[TheSkaFish]

No. Not becoming a bully but defending yourself. Always be the defender and not the attacker.

I'm against violence but every time I didn't do anything to defend myself I was bullied more because the bullies thought it's fun to harass a kid who doesn't do anything to defend. It's an easy job.

But each time I defend and counter-attack the bully, they stepped back and it may them think again that: watch out, he's unpredictible and can make me look like a fool.

I'm with Spy and Ardour on this. Especially that middle paragraph Spy, that was exactly my story. I was bullied because for years I was a quiet kid that didn't stand up for myself, and it must have been very easy for them to mark me as an outsider and verbally abuse me because they could bet that there would be no consequences. They were very much all about the popularity and needed someone to exclude and I guess that person was me. I believe in being nice and friendly and kind and having fun, and I don't believe in being nasty and picking fights but I will defend myself if need be. Then whatever happens to the bully, he essentially brought on himself. Sometimes fighting back is the only way to show them that their behavior won't be tolerated. Of course, this depends on your body type and that of the bully. In my case, they were all roughly my size, maybe even a little smaller since they were younger by 2 years and that is a lot of difference when you are still growing. The kid I knocked down back in the day, he sure didn't like me afterwards. I remember him flicking me off in the hall, but he stayed well away from me. He never got in my face again.

The problem with not fighting is that it basically communicates to the bully, "what you are doing is acceptable". There is no punishment. There is no price. The bully gets to insult/mock/steal/hurt you for free. But if you throw a good punch and get them good, perhaps the bully thinks, "calling this guy a f****t isn't worth a broken nose".

Going to adults to solve your problems doesn't always help either, because adults don't always listen to the whole story. Or worse, the bullies lie, and make you seem like the bad guy for defending yourself. That's happened to me before. When I fought back, they used their popularity to convince other kids that it was me who was just crazy. My parents confronted one of the bullies' parents before over it, and yet, nothing was really solved. Parents never think their darling all-American boy is actually an ******* who actively chooses to be one.

I suppose you could say being bullied was a learning experience. I learned that there are people out there who just aren't nice even if I don't bother them. I learned that some people spend their lives playing social pecking order games, and that they are a waste of time. I learned that other people's opinions don't matter and don't mean I am lesser unless I let them. I learned not to let someone tell me how to act and what to be interested in. And I learned that sometimes you have to fight back, and that fighting back doesn't mean you've turned nasty and can't be a sweet, friendly, happy-go-lucky person anymore. It doesn't mean you've lost your innocence. Fighting back is what you have to do when someone else takes away your choice. Fighting back doesn't make you a bully yourself, it is you standing up for your right to be happy and your right not to be insulted and treated poorly. It's reminding yourself of your self-worth, that you too have power. I am gradually letting go because like I said, I was never physically abused and words are just words, I won't let them convince me to feel inferior. Their opinions and respect are not valued to me and I know I have nothing to prove to them. I haven't had any real conflict with them in almost 10 years now and I don't think it will happen again.I guess what gets me is the shame that anyone would think to make a victim of me, and that had I fought, perhaps it would not have lasted as long as it did (from elementary up to senior year in high school). So in conclusion, no, I don't urge people in this situation to actively pick fights. Don't let them turn you nasty. But sometimes you don't have the choice, you have to defend yourself. You have to do it to stop the situation then and there, and to keep it from haunting you later.

 

[look]

Make them pay then let go.

 

[The Underdog]

I'm not going to tell anyone else what to do, but if I had a son and he were being bullied, he'd best have laid them dudes out before I hear about it. I expect a phone call like, "Mr. Valliantheart, we have to suspend your son for fighting 3 classmates and breaking their noses. Their parents are very upset, sir." Not, "Mr. V, you have to come and get your son because he's in the nurses office crying because 3 other students pounded him earlier."

 

[Groucho]

Do you agree with this premise?

No. The bullies effectively get away with it scot-free, so it's no wonder they can shrug it off (I'd like them shrug off being hit by, say, a car) because they receive no damage.

But in the case of the victim it reverberates through-out their entire life. We're not talking things people think as trivial as 'shyness' but destroys their entire world, repatterns their thinking. In my case it's completely ruined my life (bullying at school caused my grades to significantly drop that carried on through-out education, which now makes me unemployable within the job sector, so no job, no house, no independence, no finances).

In some cases, it completely ends theirs. Would you ask someone who committed suicide due to bullying to just 'let it go'? What about their affected family, do they just 'let it go'? Those with a laise-faire attitude to bullying classically are the ones who haven't actually been through it (and the ones who have will only say they should forgive their bullies because they understand hatred is not the way forward having experienced it first hand).

But if I was to let it go, would only be on the condition the bully experienced the same thing and also let it go. This to people seems harsh but I think someone who hasn't been in my situation shouldn't be in a position to tell me to let it go. And I think anyone who wasn't involved isn't in a position to tell me either. Alternatively, I'd only let it go if the bully had made sincere efforts to rectify his wrongdoing and wasn't looking for a 'get out of jail free' card.


Let's invert it for a second. Time travel back to the 1960s. Do we propose that black people simply let racism go? Just ignore it and live and let live, the KKK seem fine with it, after all. Or would we be motivated to change and improve something here? Prevent it? Oppose it? It's no good if these experiences don't result in some sort of improvement. How would letting it go helped Rosa Parks or Martin Luther King Jr? It took activism of hundreds of years just to U-turn slavery, and many years to U-turn racism.

Do we propose the same with bullying? It's the same superiority-inferiority type relationship (the bully feels superior to the victim, the KKK felt superior to the blacks, etc), except the basis isn't just colour but beliefs, glasses, intellect, whatever excuse. But we should just let it go, just ignore it, maintain status quo of ignorance and inactivity. If I punch you on the street, I'd be arrested. If a kid punches another kid in a school, uhm... nothing happens? Threat of expulsion? But we know expulsion doesn't work because of the 'include everyone' mantra. They get reincluded.

If on the street I stalk you and harass you, I can be arrested. In a school however, if a kid does that then it's horseplay. If a man hurls abuse based on colour, it's racism and an arrestable offense. If a kid punches you because you have glasses, it's... not. So it's okay for kids to be violent to other kids but not for a man to hurl abuse to another man?

Is it okay for a man to be abusive to a kid? No. But a kid to another kid is okay? What does it matter who is doing it, compared to the outcome? A punch is a punch regardless of who does it.

So why do I have to let it go knowing it has ruined my life, possibly permanently? When if it was done to me only a few years later the system would arrest, fine, jail that person. Do you think after beating up children the kid turns into a product adult of society who won't go on to do more of the same, having effectively gotten away with it?

 

[The Underdog]

There are many routes that could solve this issue. I'd say that the current generation is compromised of anti-intellectual, immature, bland hispters that think Wikipedia and YouTube fill them in on global happenings and culture. The people who think FPSrussia presents sound firearm advice, don't know what CNN is, and have MTV on their favourite channels list. So, when one is bullied by one of these, it can be said that they need to develop thick skin and carry on (like I did).

BUT . . . that doesn't mean these brats should be bullying in the first place. Sure, it wouldn't hurt if people raised hardy children, but they shouldn't be getting bullied in a place of learning. It goes both ways, and it's not just the students. Faculty and staff are just as guilty; corruption in teaching styles are rampant, especially in the south (U.S.A.). I'd know because I've experienced it. Railroaded to a retard school because you show signs of life and don't drone on with simulated sheep lessons? Or perhaps you actually want to learn in school. Who'd guess that a facility of education would be seen as a place to be . . . educated?

Back to the teachers. I've seen how they go about their work. Selecting and favouring certain students and allowing them to thrash others as much as you want. It's disgusting, and they're lucky I'm not working for the Department of Education in the USA, or 90% of teachers would be out of a job. Think I'm joking? Oh.

 

[Groucho]

There are many routes that could solve this issue. I'd say that the current generation is compromised of anti-intellectual, immature, bland hispters that think Wikipedia and YouTube fill them in on global happenings and culture. The people who think FPSrussia presents sound firearm advice, don't know what CNN is, and have MTV on their favourite channels list. So, when one is bullied by one of these, it can be said that they need to develop thick skin and carry on (like I did).

BUT . . . that doesn't mean these brats should be bullying in the first place. Sure, it wouldn't hurt if people raised hardy children, but they shouldn't be getting bullied in a place of learning. It goes both ways, and it's not just the students. Faculty and staff are just as guilty; corruption in teaching styles are rampant, especially in the south (U.S.A.). I'd know because I've experienced it. Railroaded to a retard school because you show signs of life and don't drone on with simulated sheep lessons? Or perhaps you actually want to learn in school. Who'd guess that a facility of education would be seen as a place to be . . . educated?

Back to the teachers. I've seen how they go about their work. Selecting and favouring certain students and allowing them to thrash others as much as you want. It's disgusting, and they're lucky I'm not working for the Department of Education in the USA, or 90% of teachers would be out of a job. Think I'm joking? Oh.

Apparently, a Canadian teacher transferred to Britain, and commented how bad the British education system was with handling bullying (Canada had some actual punishment system) and they said they were shocked. I personally always assumed the systems were similar in treatment, but if they are different, it might explain why people from different countries have different views on bullying.

In the UK, as part of the politically correct nanny-state, there's a 'can't hurt anyone, can't leave anyone behind' attitude (despite the fact the G4S abuse cases of immigrants, Camp Nama etc shows how the UK government really thinks) means teachers (given even libel and slander is a civil offense, opposed to freedom of speech in the US) can do little to bullies.

They can't hit them, they can't grab them, or restrain them (lest harassment charges result). They can't physically detain, or verbally scold (lest some trivial whiney money-mongering bully who has one of those rich dads who can pull legal strings sues them into the ground). Detention is the only thing handed out and if the bully isn't phased by it, there's nothing left. Expulsion is often temporary (a few days, rarely permanent) because of the 'leave no-one behind mantra'.

And because of the 'leave no-one behind' mantra, you can't segregate or isolate dangerous or hostile individuals. Irony abounds because you can have special needs schools, and private (rich) and state (poor) schools, but apparently shame on you if you separate or isolate based on victimisation, giftedness or violent tendencies. As such, gifted students are held back with the resenters and ergo bullies, victims can't escape bullies, and bullies can't be removed from victims.

There's thick skin (I received abuse from most of the students every single day I went in) and then there's crossing the line (I had crumbs thrown in my face, sweets, rulers, rubbers etc tossed at me, I had students attempt to steal my phone off of me, I had a gang of students (6+) attempt to beat me up - in full view of obviously non-caring teachers, pencil case broken, workbook buried never to be found, punched and kicked by another kid of which, again, the school did nothing, even had the teachers yell at me as if I was in the wrong for being terrified etc etc).

Most people see the single incident that snaps as a single, trite, isolated incident and can't grasp why one would break down or snap, but it's merely the straw that breaks the camels back. It's kinda like when you hear that one, same, repetitive creaking sound and eventually you snap.


Either the victims have to be isolated from the bullies, or the bullies isolated from the victims. I went to university and the peer group there were generally kind because bullies tend not to migrate to that sort of environment. University actually undid some of the damage (but the scars remain, I'm still terrified deep down that I'll go in one day and people will hurl abuse at me. Hurling of abuse happened in the workplace recently as well).

But either way, victims need safety and support (physical abuse is not cool), or the bullies need some rehab for their aggression and anger and hatred towards people where they can be kept away from other people. If a kid grows up learning they can punch other kids and get away with it, what mindset do they have when they leave school?

 

[Some_Bloke72]

I wish I could let go just as easily as you appear to think, but its not easy and I know that there are people who have experienced far worse bullying than I have. (I developed mild PTSD as a result of the bullying and suffered from serious depression as a result)

I don't like the word bullying, its far too broad a description and it makes what bullies do sound innocent. The word abuse is more accurate and like any kind of abuse it takes time to get over it.

 

[Spy]

Here is why I think the victims should never let it go. This is an article about a 15 year old boy that 5 years ago vanished and was never found again. Police don't know what happened but they now know that this 20 year old boy, if he is still alive, was a bullying victim.

http://ici.radio-canada.ca/emissions/medium_large/2013-2014/chronique.asp?idChronique=327969

 

[The Underdog]

Apparently, a Canadian teacher transferred to Britain, and commented how bad the British education system was with handling bullying (Canada had some actual punishment system) and they said they were shocked. I personally always assumed the systems were similar in treatment, but if they are different, it might explain why people from different countries have different views on bullying.

And here I was thinking Britain had its education on lock. Ha!

In the UK, as part of the politically correct nanny-state, there's a 'can't hurt anyone, can't leave anyone behind' attitude (despite the fact the G4S abuse cases of immigrants, Camp Nama etc shows how the UK government really thinks) means teachers (given even libel and slander is a civil offense, opposed to freedom of speech in the US) can do little to bullies.

Believable.

They can't hit them, they can't grab them, or restrain them (lest harassment charges result). They can't physically detain, or verbally scold (lest some trivial whiney money-mongering bully who has one of those rich dads who can pull legal strings sues them into the ground). Detention is the only thing handed out and if the bully isn't phased by it, there's nothing left. Expulsion is often temporary (a few days, rarely permanent) because of the 'leave no-one behind mantra'.

Detention only makes the issue worse. Trust me.

And because of the 'leave no-one behind' mantra, you can't segregate or isolate dangerous or hostile individuals. Irony abounds because you can have special needs schools, and private (rich) and state (poor) schools, but apparently shame on you if you separate or isolate based on victimisation, giftedness or violent tendencies. As such, gifted students are held back with the resenters and ergo bullies, victims can't escape bullies, and bullies can't be removed from victims.

There is leaving no one behind, then there is pretending that everyone is the same. You're speaking of the latter. Gifted kids really should be with gifted kids and abnormal/different kids with . . . you get it. The violent ones should be segregated and put with other violent ones. Then they'd learn to chill out. But, you know, political correctness and liberalism. I'm just saying, it's a good thing I'm not having kids. Why? They'd be taught martial arts -- the real ****. Not that hogwash taught at the YMCA.

There's thick skin (I received abuse from most of the students every single day I went in) and then there's crossing the line (I had crumbs thrown in my face, sweets, rulers, rubbers etc tossed at me, I had students attempt to steal my phone off of me, I had a gang of students (6+) attempt to beat me up - in full view of obviously non-caring teachers, pencil case broken, workbook buried never to be found, punched and kicked by another kid of which, again, the school did nothing, even had the teachers yell at me as if I was in the wrong for being terrified etc etc).

Teachers too.

Most people see the single incident that snaps as a single, trite, isolated incident and can't grasp why one would break down or snap, but it's merely the straw that breaks the camels back. It's kinda like when you hear that one, same, repetitive creaking sound and eventually you snap.

Agreed.

Either the victims have to be isolated from the bullies, or the bullies isolated from the victims. I went to university and the peer group there were generally kind because bullies tend not to migrate to that sort of environment. University actually undid some of the damage (but the scars remain, I'm still terrified deep down that I'll go in one day and people will hurl abuse at me. Hurling of abuse happened in the workplace recently as well).

They do, actually. They're called frat boys and soro sisters.

But either way, victims need safety and support (physical abuse is not cool), or the bullies need some rehab for their aggression and anger and hatred towards people where they can be kept away from other people. If a kid grows up learning they can punch other kids and get away with it, what mindset do they have when they leave school?

Them violent ones need to stay far away from my kids. You wouldn't want me to get a phone call that my child is being assaulted on the reg, especially if teachers are involved.

 

[Groucho]

And here I was thinking Britain had its education on lock. Ha!

Reeks of big brother and state brainwashing. The UK want it to start earlier (encompassing 3 to 5 year olds, when really those kids should be having fun), and the present tory government wants the hours extended from the approximate 9 to 3:30, to 9am to 6pm (they don't specify the actual time period but they want it so it's 9+ hours per day) with term time reduced to 7 weeks.

It's a move clearly so the parents can work as well, but it's disturbing because education attendance is mandatory under threat of jail (to the parents and being seized by the social workers for the kids) and thus it's basically an education-detention centre. Government wants to start earlier and for longer? The hours are longer than a full-time job, say nothing of the teachers who already take work outside of work.

Imagine if you're a victimed kid and you're stuck for 9, 10 hours in a school nearly every day of the week with no real opportunity to escape (I had to refuse to attend school before any real action was taken and I didn't attend for nearly 2 years straight before something was done.).

Believable.

Tip of the iceberg too. It seems the examining board has it's own element of corruption too. I was the one who could explain the subjects in A-level history (had to hold my tongue so other people could get a chance to learn). I came back with an E - it baffled my peers (one said they were expecting at least an B from me) and my teachers, of whom admitted there was an element of corruption within the examining board. Someone else wrote a single page on the complicated subject of World War II and they got an A.

Detention only makes the issue worse. Trust me.

They blame the victim for it, become more aggressive, rinse, repeat.

There is leaving no one behind, then there is pretending that everyone is the same. You're speaking of the latter. Gifted kids really should be with gifted kids and abnormal/different kids with . . . you get it. The violent ones should be segregated and put with other violent ones. Then they'd learn to chill out. But, you know, political correctness and liberalism. I'm just saying, it's a good thing I'm not having kids. Why? They'd be taught martial arts -- the real ****. Not that hogwash taught at the YMCA.

The UK government doesn't distinguish. Their idea of not leaving anyone behind is to have them in the same boat as if it's the only option available. Ironically, they even segregate the individual lessons based on capability (topset, bottomset, so on), but the tutor groups remain consistent of the same individuals - IE both top and bottomset. The end result is the bottomset resent the topset and attack them and the topset performance suffers.

And they'll keep the same tutor group together even for several years straight. I don't get why it isn't changed per year based on performance like everything else.

Gifted kids don't have to be isolated per se (most people who were gifted kid I had spoken to hated the idea of being isolated from their peers), but I don't think they should be given the same resources (because if they have an enhanced capability to learn, why deny that opportunity?). Bullies, or victims, or both, do need to be segregated. I personally think bullies should be segregated because the victims haven't done anything wrong per se and the segregation would seem like a stigmatisation or a punishment.

Teachers too.

Ranged from the incompetent, to the uncaring, to the malicious.

The 6+ who attempted to beat me up, because I realised the teachers weren't going to intervene, I ran into a classroom (it was during lunch break) and attempted to barricade the door with the tables (catch-22: if the teachers intervened over the noise/disruption they'd have to stop the bullies, but if they did nothing then I could utilise the classroom objects to my whim). They started to get through so using another table I hopped out of the ground-floor window so they would be forced to run around (the 'leader' was clearly too fat to fit through).

What if a kid wasn't as resourceful and quick-thinking as I was though? They didn't manage to lay a single finger on me.

Karate is overrated and didn't work for me. I just didn't want to hurt other kids, so any grasp on violence is irrelevant. Most of what I did was to run, hide or outwit. It's far too easy to injure (I could have utilised the classroom items differently: imagine if I opted for a science lab instead of an English classroom?). I think it takes a greater strength to not attack back (I also think it's partially insulting to my detractors, as if to say 'you're not a big enough threat for me to bother attacking'). 6+ guys didn't even get to hit me, and I wasn't even attacking them.

They do, actually. They're called frat boys and soro sisters.

I'm not sure what American education system is like compared to university in the UK, although I've been told there are differences. In the UK you have to score a minimum set of points within A-levels to proceed, which means any slackers don't progress (unless it's through 'clearing' but it's good odds they're on an unimportant course). I'd say I had at most two aggressive individuals in a course of 30+. I'm not saying the 28+ others were intellectuals or anything, just they were overall nice (I couldn't care what something did with their education or abilities as it's their choice, so long as they weren't nasty to people).

I'd concur in the case of the American university because you get, as you say, the 'frat boy' types which are basically the side-tracked rich boy types who are enrolled by the parents hoping they might achieve something. The American universities also have a lot of sports scholarships which means it's not based on capabilities within education per se, but physical toughness (which means it fast-tracks the more aggressive people into the universities).

Not going to misrepresent the UK universities as a haven though. They're basically giant cash cows.

Them violent ones need to stay far away from my kids. You wouldn't want me to get a phone call that my child is being assaulted on the reg, especially if teachers are involved.

Any concerned parent would blow a fuse, but my mother was largely indifferent (and my dad had physically abused me as a kid and had left many years prior), the school etc likewise. Only way I could protest was by not turning up. Beating my detractors senseless about the wrongness of violence seemed ironic and hypocritical, and staying there doing nothing was suicidal.

Whole experience made me disinclined to have kids (and social isolation assures that will happen anyway), although if I was to have any, they would have to be obligatory home-schooled, and I would teach them everything the school failed to teach that was necessary and a useful skill. But I don't think I could homeschool them in the UK, because the social services (aptly named the 'SS') have many cases where they do not like parents who defy the status quo of the system and thus try to seize the child on pretentious grounds (their failings with Baby Peter, a bruised toddler who died because they ignored him, and Daniel Pelka, a kid who literally starved to death in-front of everyone including teachers, social workers, police and medical staff: who all did nothing).

Just one more reason I hate this country so much.

 

[ABrokenMan]

It's one of those things that will always effect my life.
So, I can't just let it go, but I'm not going to let it take over, neither.
Basically...

This self reflection of grief is so spot-on. Agree 100%

---

I was bullied a bit as a child, mainly because I was a loner, and kept to myself. The most memorable "bully" was a little kid, maybe a grade / year younger than I was (I was 9 years old). Every day, on the bus, this kid and his "flock" would roam about the school bus on our way to school each morning, and troll for someone to harass. I would be a target every so often. If I shoved or fought back, it only brought on more physical stuff and a regular visit. Fading into the background made it easier to cope with. The bus driver, a woman of middle age, did absolutely nothing. The kids were always yelling, screaming, talking loud, changing seats.

One day in late winter, it had snowed. Mom gave me a red wool hat to wear. I got on the bus. Since our stop was one of the last stops to pick up kids before heading off to the school, there no empty seats to be had. you had to find someone who would let you sit with them. Many times, you would spend the rest of the ride standing up, even though it was against safety rules.
On that day, I was able to find a shared seat with a very quiet girl. She was painfully shy. At least a year younger than I was at the time. And because of this, she was an easy target for "Frank", the bully and his bozo brigade (think of those goofy cartoons where a gang leader is a little dweeb, and the big thugs are stupid buffoons...well, that's how these kids were).

I cannot remember this girl's name, but for the rest of my life, I will never forget her crying, her screams in peril calling the name of the bus driver, as Frank tormented her - he would poke her, toss the foods inside of her lunchbox on the floor and step on it, spit in her face, mess up her long curled hair, while laughing the entire time. And, god help me, I was GLAD when Frank would harrass her, because it meant he would leave ME alone for the ride. It was hell that year.

Oh, Frank would get reprimanded every once in a while, but he was never removed from the bus. I think he had parents who were "important" in the scene of big business or politics. I dunno. i just could not understand how someone could just pick on someone else for fun. It warped my mind. and nothing was ever done.

Well, on that winter morning, I had boarded the bus and sat with the girl, as aforementioned. She slid in and sat next to the window. I sat on the edge of the seat, the "aisle" position. Frank had been making his way to the rear of the bus (that is where the rowdy kids would congregate and pick on their targets for the ride). When he saw me sit down, with my red winter hat on, he immediately came over and started his bully tactics. He yanked the hat off my head, laughing, while I commanded that he "Give it back". My hat was then tossed around from thug to thug. Frank grabbed my lunchbox too, took out my sandwich, stomped on it and put it back inside saying something like "It will taste better now..". I tried to wrestle it back before he took it, but he was a lot stronger despite being a little prick.

Finally, after what seemed like an hour (it was only a 5 minute ride from our bus stop to the school) Frank pretended to return my hat, but went to the other side of the bus, shoved some kid out of the way in his seat, opened the window, and tossed my hat out the window, while laughing. I thought of my mom right then, how she would go through all the trouble to dress me warm, make my lunch, etc and it made me cry. I felt like I failed her. Which made me really really pissed off. I got up and took a swing at Frank, I think I missed my target (his face), because I'd never thrown a punch in my life before that day. He was so shocked, he belted me hard, right in the stomach, and I fell back into my seat. I was gasping for air. Frank then felt "victorious" and sauntered up the aisle (the goons HAD to be the first kids off the bus, every day. They would shove you back in your seat ("We will tell you when YOU can get off...").

The bus pulled into the school driveway. I gathered up my lunchbox and notebook and tried to get back to "normal". It was always hard after getting harassed. That is when the little girl with the curly hair took my arm. i looked at her. She was smiling, shyly, sort of afraid to look at me. She kissed me on the cheek, and said, very softly, "Thank You". I didn't realize it at the time, but because Frank had focused on me, she was left alone. I had protected her.

I never saw that girl again after that day. Her mom, fed up with the unconcern from the bus driver and the school board, drove her to school every day. As for me, Frank would still bother me, but I would not be a willing target anymore. It was amazing that he was allowed to continue his behavior. He ended up moving away to the neighboring town. He ended up playing semi-pro hockey (no surprise). But I got the last laugh. That day I stumbled upon Frank's obituary in the newspaper, where he had passed away at a young age (maybe 30 or so). I had not thought about him in a long time, but that day on the bus came rushing back - all the feelings, etc. And I let out a cheer, for myself, and for the tormented little girl who rode the bus with me.

 

[ardour]

Back to the teachers. I've seen how they go about their work. Selecting and favouring certain students and allowing them to thrash others as much as you want. It's disgusting, and they're lucky I'm not working for the Department of Education in the USA, or 90% of teachers would be out of a job. Think I'm joking? Oh.

Yes definitely a common occurrence, teachers favour popular students who then get away with practically anything. The adults are basically big kids trying to fit in, big kids who went into teaching thinking it were an easy option. It's tragic the number of kids who've had their academic progress stunted via bullying and relational aggression.

School boards, the teacher's unions are more interested in making their jobs easy; quickly identify the average to less able kids early on, then stream them out of the harder subjects since it might actually involve some effort to teach them the curriculum. Of course the bright or the kids who's parents can afford tutoring don't require much help so it works out well - just sit and read the paper for the majority of the lessons.

Education is one area where neo-liberal theories around choice and competition start to make sense.

 

[panfruit]

There are many routes that could solve this issue. I'd say that the current generation is compromised of anti-intellectual, immature, bland hispters that think Wikipedia and YouTube fill them in on global happenings and culture. The people who think FPSrussia presents sound firearm advice, don't know what CNN is, and have MTV on their favourite channels list. So, when one is bullied by one of these, it can be said that they need to develop thick skin and carry on (like I did).

BUT . . . that doesn't mean these brats should be bullying in the first place. Sure, it wouldn't hurt if people raised hardy children, but they shouldn't be getting bullied in a place of learning. It goes both ways, and it's not just the students. Faculty and staff are just as guilty; corruption in teaching styles are rampant, especially in the south (U.S.A.). I'd know because I've experienced it. Railroaded to a retard school because you show signs of life and don't drone on with simulated sheep lessons? Or perhaps you actually want to learn in school. Who'd guess that a facility of education would be seen as a place to be . . . educated?

Back to the teachers. I've seen how they go about their work. Selecting and favouring certain students and allowing them to thrash others as much as you want. It's disgusting, and they're lucky I'm not working for the Department of Education in the USA, or 90% of teachers would be out of a job. Think I'm joking? Oh.

Apparently, a Canadian teacher transferred to Britain, and commented how bad the British education system was with handling bullying (Canada had some actual punishment system) and they said they were shocked. I personally always assumed the systems were similar in treatment, but if they are different, it might explain why people from different countries have different views on bullying.

In the UK, as part of the politically correct nanny-state, there's a 'can't hurt anyone, can't leave anyone behind' attitude (despite the fact the G4S abuse cases of immigrants, Camp Nama etc shows how the UK government really thinks) means teachers (given even libel and slander is a civil offense, opposed to freedom of speech in the US) can do little to bullies.

They can't hit them, they can't grab them, or restrain them (lest harassment charges result). They can't physically detain, or verbally scold (lest some trivial whiney money-mongering bully who has one of those rich dads who can pull legal strings sues them into the ground). Detention is the only thing handed out and if the bully isn't phased by it, there's nothing left. Expulsion is often temporary (a few days, rarely permanent) because of the 'leave no-one behind mantra'.

And because of the 'leave no-one behind' mantra, you can't segregate or isolate dangerous or hostile individuals. Irony abounds because you can have special needs schools, and private (rich) and state (poor) schools, but apparently shame on you if you separate or isolate based on victimisation, giftedness or violent tendencies. As such, gifted students are held back with the resenters and ergo bullies, victims can't escape bullies, and bullies can't be removed from victims.

There's thick skin (I received abuse from most of the students every single day I went in) and then there's crossing the line (I had crumbs thrown in my face, sweets, rulers, rubbers etc tossed at me, I had students attempt to steal my phone off of me, I had a gang of students (6+) attempt to beat me up - in full view of obviously non-caring teachers, pencil case broken, workbook buried never to be found, punched and kicked by another kid of which, again, the school did nothing, even had the teachers yell at me as if I was in the wrong for being terrified etc etc).

Most people see the single incident that snaps as a single, trite, isolated incident and can't grasp why one would break down or snap, but it's merely the straw that breaks the camels back. It's kinda like when you hear that one, same, repetitive creaking sound and eventually you snap.


Either the victims have to be isolated from the bullies, or the bullies isolated from the victims. I went to university and the peer group there were generally kind because bullies tend not to migrate to that sort of environment. University actually undid some of the damage (but the scars remain, I'm still terrified deep down that I'll go in one day and people will hurl abuse at me. Hurling of abuse happened in the workplace recently as well).

But either way, victims need safety and support (physical abuse is not cool), or the bullies need some rehab for their aggression and anger and hatred towards people where they can be kept away from other people. If a kid grows up learning they can punch other kids and get away with it, what mindset do they have when they leave school?

Bullies need to be wihpped with a zero-tolerance policy. You bully, you get the boot. Period. Always. In my experience no one really gave a crap and so serious abuse was a daily thing. No tolerance, ever. Solved.

 

[ladyforsaken]

Back to the teachers. I've seen how they go about their work. Selecting and favouring certain students and allowing them to thrash others as much as you want. It's disgusting, and they're lucky I'm not working for the Department of Education in the USA, or 90% of teachers would be out of a job. Think I'm joking? Oh.

Yes definitely a common occurrence, teachers favour popular students who then get away with practically anything. The adults are basically big kids trying to fit in, big kids who went into teaching thinking it were an easy option. It's tragic the number of kids who've had their academic progress stunted via bullying and relational aggression.

School boards, the teacher's unions are more interested in making their jobs easy; quickly identify the average to less able kids early on, then stream them out of the harder subjects since it might actually involve some effort to teach them the curriculum. Of course the bright or the kids who's parents can afford tutoring don't require much help so it works out well - just sit and read the paper for the majority of the lessons.

Education is one area where neo-liberal theories around choice and competition start to make sense.

*sighs*