When did rape become funny?

[nerdygirl]

I get why people feel offended, but I think people take it too far- especially people who get offended without even being the "butt" of a joke.

Like one time, I was giving some advice about a condition I have that somebody else had. I jokingly called us "freaks" and somebody else got very huffy with me. That, in itself, made me feel offended.

 

[Limlim]

I nearly **** my pants laughing at white flour >_<

 

[JamaisVu]

I might be in over my head here, but why is it their own problem? They didn't voluntarily choose to be abused and they didn't voluntarily choose to react negatively to the cake. If they voluntarily chose to see the cake in the first place, I could see your point.

A person can either choose to dwell on something and let it eat away at them, or just move on and "live and let live". If a certain topic is going to upset me, I avoid it. Society makes it easy enough to avoid really tasteless jokes because tact and politeness are usually employed -- that is a good thing. I don't try and dictate to others what subjects they're allowed to talk about or joke about though, my happiness is not the responsibility of others. It's "my problem" in that sense. I don't think it's right to take away people's fun just because it bothers me personally when it's something like a joke that's meant to make people smile (and generally does).

I don't believe this discussion is about censorship at all. It's about taste and sensibilities.

Political correctness is closely related to censorship. The OP was dismayed to see the word "rape" used lightly around the internet and it's not tactful to make light of such issues in places that are meant to be welcoming to everyone. But the subject is "When did rape become funny?" so I expounded on how I can understand why rape is funny to some people, in the right circumstances, and how it has its place in dark comedy. It's one thing to encourage people to be tactful and take such banter elsewhere, but condemning the joke as a concept feels like it's heading into thought-crime territory.

I believe this thread was sparked by people not acting in such a manner.

True, I had my more tasteless jokes in mind which are less common.

I don't think it's a bad thing to be mindful of the people who would be offended by this particular material.

I agree. It's possible I've offended people simply by using such jokes as examples. I come here to discuss all sorts of topics and I'd like to be able to speak my mind without being censored though. If this discussion offends someone, should it not be allowed? Should we be condemned for having it? I'd say no, maybe others would argue yes. I'd encourage tact and mindfulness, not enforce it or condemn others for their sense of humor, and I'd also encourage people to just lighten up a little.

An old slang phrase "He killed that ****" came to mind. "Kill" as an action is very bad. But the speakers of that slang sentence don't mean it in such a literal sense, and neither do people who say "rape" frivolously or as a creative use of language. If the phrase was "He raped that ****" then some people would get their feelings hurt. I'm polite in general but I wouldn't want to live in a society where we must avoid using the word "kill" or "murder" lightly for fear of offending someone with a murdered relative, or where we can't crack jokes about theft because someone may have been a mugging victim, etc. I could discuss cactii and it may trigger an unpleasant memory in someone (such as myself, I had an unpleasant run-in once with one in the California desert).

Words and concepts are variable in practice and rape means different things to different people in a sense. Everyone knows the dictionary meaning, but for some the word alone will conjure up strong negative emotions, for others there's just no emotion whatsoever and it's a source of humor, for still others maybe it's a turn-on if they're into consensual roleplay. If the intent behind a person's meaning is benign and the emotions behind it merely differ from mine, I see no reason to feel offended by it. It's a reminder of a bad memory, nothing more.

Edit: I thought Nazi Poppin' Fresh was funny tho, I hope that doesn't invalidate everything else I said

So genocide's fair game but slang or joke usage of the word "rape" is tacky? You're going to have a toasty place in Hell reserved for you, right along with me and Limlim

 

[Pheenix]

Hmm... I'm kind of uncertain where you stand. If say someone went into fairly dubious territory with their jokes in a highly public setting, such as a party with several listeners, would you encourage him to keep going or turn down the raunchiness?

 

[JamaisVu]

Hmm... I'm kind of uncertain where you stand. If say someone went into fairly dubious territory with their jokes in a highly public setting, such as a party with several listeners, would you encourage him to keep going or turn down the raunchiness?

It would depend on how well he knows his audience. If he's not close with the party-goers, I'd discourage him from telling the joke. I generally don't broach highly controversial topics with strangers out of a sense of politeness and privacy. If it's literally a matter of only "several listeners" that he knows very well and he knows they like raunchy humor, then I would encourage him to tell the joke.

 

[Pheenix]

I see. I think we agree then.

 

[Equinox]

That makes three of us.

 

[Limlim]

 

[SophiaGrace]

I'm one of those horrible people who can joke about anything, given the "right" circumstances. And I mean anything. Of course some topics are more sensitive than others, and for those cracking "rape jokes" (although, truth be told, I have never experienced anyone doing this, including myself) they better be sure there's nobody within hearing distance that might have been a victim once. What is joked about in private, between friends, is a slightly different matter, and as long as nobody hears is that can take offense, I see no harm in it.

Honestly to me this sounds a bit like people who think its ok to tell racist jokes as long as no one black or asian happens to be about.

As for never experiencing it I started this topic after seeing flippant messages in the shoutbox. I kind of regret it though because its a topic too close to home for me and some of the replies I find a little hard to deal with.

Maybe other people can carry on the topic and have a good debate but for me its time to bow out.

Well, i must ask you, why did you want to debate a subject like this if it is too close to home?

Perhaps you just made a mistake, but a debate means to debate all sides, and well, obviously you're going to disagree with the opposing side, so, you best make sure when you open a debate thread that you are able to debate the topic without getting too upset. If that makes sense I mean.

I AM sorry about what might've happened to you or someone close to you. Just, I guess be aware of the perils of opening debate threads (and really, threads in general), in the sense that you might not agree with everything people post.

*hug*

 

[mintymint]

I don't believe this discussion is about censorship at all. It's about taste and sensibilities.

Political correctness is closely related to censorship... It's one thing to encourage people to be tactful and take such banter elsewhere, but condemning the joke as a concept feels like it's heading into thought-crime territory.

Well, i don't think it was about political correctness at all. Just about decency and thoughtfulness. And i don't condemn the thought of it, just the actions regarding it. I like being able to think sketchy things (wary)

I don't think it's a bad thing to be mindful of the people who would be offended by this particular material.

I agree. It's possible I've offended people simply by using such jokes as examples. I come here to discuss all sorts of topics and I'd like to be able to speak my mind without being censored though. If this discussion offends someone, should it not be allowed? Should we be condemned for having it? I'd say no, maybe others would argue yes. I'd encourage tact and mindfulness, not enforce it or condemn others for their sense of humor, and I'd also encourage people to just lighten up a little.

An old slang phrase "He killed that ****" came to mind. "Kill" as an action is very bad. But the speakers of that slang sentence don't mean it in such a literal sense, and neither do people who say "rape" frivolously or as a creative use of language. If the phrase was "He raped that ****" then some people would get their feelings hurt. I'm polite in general but I wouldn't want to live in a society where we must avoid using the word "kill" or "murder" lightly for fear of offending someone with a murdered relative, or where we can't crack jokes about theft because someone may have been a mugging victim, etc. I could discuss cactii and it may trigger an unpleasant memory in someone (such as myself, I had an unpleasant run-in once with one in the California desert).

Words and concepts are variable in practice and rape means different things to different people in a sense. Everyone knows the dictionary meaning, but for some the word alone will conjure up strong negative emotions, for others there's just no emotion whatsoever and it's a source of humor, for still others maybe it's a turn-on if they're into consensual roleplay. If the intent behind a person's meaning is benign and the emotions behind it merely differ from mine, I see no reason to feel offended by it. It's a reminder of a bad memory, nothing more.

Well, the good thing is that you never have to risk offending a murder victim. And well, with thing such as racial slurs, you get cues from a person's appearance that tell you not to say certain things to them or around them. But with something such as rape, you don't know who has been through it. And if you've seen someone who suffers with that pain deal with that humor in a social situation, it really can make you cringe. Just from personal experience, anyway.

Edit: I thought Nazi Poppin' Fresh was funny tho, I hope that doesn't invalidate everything else I said

So genocide's fair game but slang or joke usage of the word "rape" is tacky? You're going to have a toasty place in Hell reserved for you, right along with me and Limlim

Ahh, yeah, I'm awful. I always get stuck with Lim I guess I could try to say that Naziism peaked long ago and it is more a part of history (despite there being a contemporary movement) and rape is an ongoing crime throughout human history that has and continues to affect more people so it's relevance is elevated, but I'm probably reaching or something

 

[edgecrusher]

like with many words, it has developed an alternate slang meaning. thats all it is. its like how people say something is gay when they mean its stupid. the meanings of the words change in different generations. for the word rape, when someone beats someone at something like a game i sometimes hear it used when one person beat the other person by a large amount. it used to be "he owned him" and now sometimes its "he raped him" in that kind of scenario. it isnt meant to poke fun at the actual meaning of the word. i think people tend to get offended too easily over small stuff.

 

[blackhole]

hmm

rape isn't a funny joke

but baby smashing is hi-la-rious

selective outrage is kinda lame

selective outrage shows when a person is:

- A) really coming from a principled point-of-view

or

- B) just being an ass

 

[mintymint]

hmm

rape isn't a funny joke

but baby smashing is hi-la-rious

selective outrage is kinda lame

selective outrage shows when a person is:

- A) really coming from a principled point-of-view

or

- B) just being an ass

It's the ability to discriminate and differentiate between different concepts and situations. Kinda fundamental, don't you think? As if someone would be outraged at everything. Although some people just seem to have a lot of anger. It's nice to see when they manage to keep themselves under control though. lol.

 

[Drama]

I think joking about it is generally in poor taste.

(d)

I agree with you, stumble. How something which hurt someone so much can be a way of entertainement for another? It just seem that people nowadays dont care whether a subject is hurtful or not.

 

[JamaisVu]

Well, the good thing is that you never have to risk offending a murder victim.

They leave behind families though. My point was just that everything is potentially offensive to someone at some point. And many people are easily offended.

Ahh, yeah, I'm awful. I always get stuck with Lim I guess I could try to say that Naziism peaked long ago and it is more a part of history (despite there being a contemporary movement) and rape is an ongoing crime throughout human history that has and continues to affect more people so it's relevance is elevated, but I'm probably reaching or something

Maybe a little but you're laughing at a photoshopped Pillsbury Doughboy, not a concentration camp survivor, and that's totally OK in my book. Racism hasn't been obliterated from our society and I've met genuine racists, but that joke clearly wasn't intended to seriously condone such beliefs. Anyone who thinks it does is very much missing the point.

It's the same with the rape box. Someone who finds humor in a weirdly-labeled box reading "RAPE 40 LBS" is different than a rapist. No act of rape is depicted in that photo. It's a cardboard box with a caption. People are poking fun at a weird box label, not a rape victim. I daresay most people wouldn't laugh if that box contained a woman who'd been sexually assaulted and stuffed in a cardboard box. It also wouldn't be tactful to pass around that joke at an institution devoted to counseling rape victims. Personally I'd like to think that if I were rape victim and some time had passed and I received such a box in the mail, I'd have the sense of humor and perspective to say "I think I'll pass on opening this one! " instead of taking it personally and condemning insensitive packaging manufacturers. And I do want to open it! It always makes me so curious about what it must have contained to carry such an absurd label.

I'm guilty of being offended by such humor too though. One time it irked me that some guy used an avatar of a kitty in a blender. I wholly supported his right to use it, but I didn't like it at all. Until I realized he probably just had a sense of humor and was laughing at a photo of a cat in a funny pose. Not a blended cat, not animal cruelty. It dawned on me because I remembered that I had once joked about pan-frying my pet hamster. It's funny to see someone standing in the kitchen with a cute little rodent in a (unheated!) skillet claiming we're going to have "Ham" for dinner. So I firmly untwisted my knickers and admitted that not only had I jumped to conclusions about someone I didn't even know, I was also being a hypocrite. Someone who's witnessed animal cruelty may find such jokes offensive and the PETA brigade might not see the humor, but they're missing the point (benign intent, humor). That guy's avatar wasn't the most tasteful and I wouldn't use it for myself. But it made me think far more than the prettier avatars and the admins tolerate users with highly offensive opinions precisely for that reason -- it sparks thought, debate, discussion. That's more productive than hurt feelings.

stumble may have bowed out of the conversation, but she started it with good intentions and it's a good issue to discuss. Given that all ages are welcome here, not every user will really understand the seriousness of rape in an empathetic sense or be aware of social etiquette surrounding the issue. Maybe they'll take more care with how they phrase things, and maybe people who are offended by banter will grow to be more tolerant of differences in opinion and see things from the other person's perspective.

its like how people say something is gay when they mean its stupid.

This is an interesting example and I saw a heated debate about that very issue once that made me decide to take more care not to use "gay" like that around the general public. The intent is benign and it doesn't offend me at all, but maybe it doesn't do our culture any favors. I'd use it only if I know it's not going to make my listeners feel like there's something so undesirable about them that their sexuality has become a widespread synonym for "bad".

 

[WishingWell]

Rape is nothing to joke about--no matter what the circumstances!

 

[Pheenix]

Care to elaborate, Wishing Well?
If that sounded cold, it wasn't. I'm curious.

 

[WishingWell]

Curious? O.K. I was a victim in my early 20's. I don't want to elaborate anymore than that.

 

[Pheenix]

I see. I am sorry for you.

 

[Equinox]

I'm just gonna save myself a lot of time, and say "I agree with everything JamaisVu says". =)