Is Rap Real Music?

[flaneur]

People are answering two very different questions here: 1) Is rap actually music, i.e., does it fit the dictionary definition of 'music'? 2) Is rap serious music, in the way that some people don't consider 15 Shades of Whatever serious fiction or graffiti serious art?

The first one is obvious, but the second one is what I think what people are really saying when they discredit rap as an artform, although it's lost in all the ambiguity of everyday language. Personally, I don't care if something is high art or low art or trash, and I don't care about the image. I judge it solely by how good it is to me.

Jedi Mind Tricks - Uncommon Valor (feat. RA The Rugged Man)
[video=youtube]
The whole song is worth a listen but I'm specifically interested in showing off RA's verse (so listen until or skip to 1:33) which not only demonstrates an amazing flow, but is also a great example of mature storytelling in rap.

Heh, JMT is the first thing I thought of when I saw this thread as well.

[youtube]8ctpic0VhrA[/youtube]

Notice how in the final lines of the last verse he realizes they went the entire song without much profanity, so he throws in a bunch of hateful nonsense before finishing -- and this is one of their cleaner songs. I don't think there's much defending these kinds of lyrics, and they're usually really just there for not much more reason than to maintain a street image. I won't even begin on MF Doom throwing in something about Arabs at every opportunity. That said, I'll listen to music regardless of its lyrical content, as long as its good. And yes, some rap and hip-hop can be damn good.

 

[Woz]

I like rap with words i can relate to. I like American rap but when i listen to some UK rap, i can feel it.

It's stupid when people compare US to UK rap scenes. It just shouldn't be done. We don't compare art masterpieces because each bit of artwork is unique.

 

[Lilianna]

[youtube]aEuB6F7CLKI[/youtube]
[youtube]wD5s6X56mBs[/youtube]

 

[aspalas]

Rap is real music, although I don't like it. The only music that I don't consider as real is music that is produced with making money as the only purpose. Bands/artists etc. who lack talent, use autotune because in reality they can't sing, and don't even write their own music, don't make real music. I think most of you will agree.

 

[Woz]

Rap is real music, although I don't like it. The only music that I don't consider as real is music that is produced with making money as the only purpose. Bands/artists etc. who lack talent, use autotune because in reality they can't sing, and don't even write their own music, don't make real music. I think most of you will agree.

I agree. Music is constantly being ruined by said bands/artists, the X factor for example chose James Arthur because he "would sell more albums" even though Jahmene clearly had the better talent

 

[ladyforsaken]

I agree. Music is constantly being ruined by said bands/artists, the X factor for example chose James Arthur because he "would sell more albums" even though Jahmene clearly had the better talent

Even though I didn't catch that whole season, I do agree with you when I saw a few of their performances!

 

[Greb]

Well I'd like to mischievously push you into the mud and then grin at you while pronouncing rap to stand for nothing other than ******* Attempting Poetry, but I won't, because I'm not that nasty, really.

I don't consider it music largely because you need some degree of talent to produce music (ouch, I know, but it's how I feel)

I've seen people who can't sing simply add a beat behind it, then ensure they change the tone of their voice and keep up a decent tempo basically become rappers. It's generally 90% style and swagger, 5% lyrics (as with all songs, singing about something people can relate to is a massive requirement in order to get noticed and liked) and then 5% talent. There's even a mock set up to do with a guy on youtube called Antoine Dodson I believe, he basically had a ******* styled "slightly below average intelligence slur" interview with some guy, and these two kids made it into a fairly okay to listen to rap. With minimal effort. This is why rap isn't music, just bad poetry.

You can argue that some of the "better" music bands, such as the Indie ones, simply sing about five different lines and then slap the same chorus down four times in one song, and claim that's talent. At least the music holds a tune and can reach deeper into your soul, stimulating you...instead of it just being background noise, like listening to someone talking in a funny way.

My opinion, anyway.

 

[flaneur]

Rap: Better than listening to generic crap like Saliva.

My opinion, anyway.

 

[RJLJD]

Well I'd like to mischievously push you into the mud and then grin at you while pronouncing rap to stand for nothing other than ******* Attempting Poetry, but I won't, because I'm not that nasty, really.

very clever, never heard that one before...

I don't consider it music largely because you need some degree of talent to produce music (ouch, I know, but it's how I feel)

I've seen people who can't sing simply add a beat behind it, then ensure they change the tone of their voice and keep up a decent tempo basically become rappers.

All music has its bad points, the lesser of its genre. What you're depicting isn't even really rap. Its mashed up sampling. You're putting something in a box where it doesn't belong. Its that simple. Open your mind a little.

It's generally 90% style and swagger, 5% lyrics (as with all songs, singing about something people can relate to is a massive requirement in order to get noticed and liked) and then 5% talent.

"You talkin' about swag? Im gonna change the topics to lyrics and then brag..." - Joe Budden, a rapper, denouncing this stupid concept that is "swag".

This is why rap isn't music, just bad poetry.

[video=youtube]

a video, with an example of the lyrical quality of rap music. to get to the actual part that i want you to see, skip to about 2:30. this guy literally breaks down the rhyme scheme to "Lose Yourself" by Eminem. crafting that song took definite skill. to combine the multiple syllable rhyme schemes, remain in rhythm and create an Academy Award winning song that drips with emotion like this is far from simply "bad poetry".

You can argue that some of the "better" music bands, such as the Indie ones, simply sing about five different lines and then slap the same chorus down four times in one song, and claim that's talent. At least the music holds a tune and can reach deeper into your soul, stimulating you...instead of it just being background noise, like listening to someone talking in a funny way.
My opinion, anyway.

[video=youtube]


accurately tell me what this song is about, and then tell me you think rap is merely "bad poetry". at that point, i consider your opinion valid.

 

[Greb]

You don't have to consider my opinion valid for it to mean something, though. It was obvious you weren't going to agree but, I tried.

Have to admit Eminem isn't a bad stick, really. I used to listen to his music and still find myself maybe begrudgingly tapping my foot to his songs...but I suppose I just think of rap as the thuglyfe git ho's blat cops grab munay type, and that stereotype suits me just fine and won't ever go away :x since I've only heard pieces of songs (but quite a varied amount, since it tends to be on youtube videos/radio/music channel cousin watches in this house but I've never had any desire to get closer to it than I actually have to, I've never taken in any artists and stuff like that. You can call it ignorance, I guess.

I didn't watch your youtube videos for that reason, but since you pulled Eminem out of the air (even if it's just a "making of" video and not a song, I agree with your addendum about rap not being able to reach into your soul/carry a tune simply from some of his songs I've heard.)

Regardless, won't change my mind. Guess I could argue it's music from another culture and I'd need to be part of that culture to enjoy it..but I dunno. I'm just not a rap person when it boils down to it.

Also I didn't reference swag. I referenced swagger. The act of moving confidently, with feeling and a purpose behind you. Believe it stems from the Celtic/Scottish was of just charging their opponents with a particular walk cause of their attire..but again I'm not sure.

Rap: Better than listening to generic crap like Saliva.

My opinion, anyway.

I dunno if you were replying to me or not, cause of the "My opinion, anyway" thing mimicking my final words, but whatever. I generally list to a large amount of music, not just "generic crap" like Saliva. Even then I don't even keep all of their music - I've only got about four songs from Saliva I actually like. It's all about the way music connects with you, really. If the beat is good in your opinion, then yay, and if you like that particular type of singing and/or musical instrument music, also yay. If you've say, had a recent relationship break or you've had one once in your life you might be more likely to listen to the more "emo" music of the genre. I guess. If you like partying hard or just flaring yourself up inside, you might like rock. It's a differing matter of opinion anyway...humans are unique, complicated and annoying, and so are their music tastes.

People are as touchy and aggressive over music (this isn't aimed at you, it's an addendum) as they are over religion, sometimes, lol. Least there's never any wars fought over it (to my knowledge) just tiny debates.

 

[RJLJD]

Greb, it is what it is. You're self-admittedly (albeit with resistance) naming your opinion as an "ignorant" one (your words, not mine). With that in mind, I'm willing to call a spade a spade and drop the subject. When you think rap, you think straight to stereotypes and negativity. You recognize it, you have no desire to change, and I recognize that.

My only qualm then would be if you thought lesser of the musical tastes of others that like the genre, but you know what, that would be you're problem too. I'll leave it at that.