Female attraction to beards and tattoos

[Alma lost her spoon]

Out of curiosity, how old is this guy? I remember that the girl you talk about is 19/almost 20, so I'm just wondering if he is quite young as well.

He's the girl's boyfriend.....You know, the one that "stole" the girl from SkaFish.

 

[TheSkaFish]

I'm of the mindset that a stable, sane, mature, good guy doesn't go around overdosing on drugs and spending time in jail, and that stuff like that should carry more weight than what he looks like.

Out of curiosity, how old is this guy? I remember that the girl you talk about is 19/almost 20, so I'm just wondering if he is quite young as well.

I don't think so. But doing stuff like that is always a dumb move, regardless of your age. And it's still a question of what kind of person does that? And what kind of person can't see that a guy who thinks it's okay to do that stuff, is a loser? My guess is someone who is hung up on crime and being "badass" and thinking that stuff is cool. And other things. But I'd rather not get into it.

I think age is part of the problem because that's what young people are like. People at that age are into crime and criminals and rebellion, whether it's justified or not. Idk. When I was growing up, people from perfectly safe, normal, nice backgrounds, even wealthy carefree backgrounds, were all about gangsta rap, making a big deal out of ghettos, guns, pimps, drugs, gangs and stuff like that. It seemed stupid, but they did it anyway.

 

[Solivagant]

But doing stuff like that is always a dumb move, regardless of your age.

Yes, but young adults are more likely to make dumb moves in the name of rebellion (or on the other end, out of misplaced idealism; dumb moves in general, really). Many people in their 20's, especially early 20's, are drifters and haven't pinpointed their ideals yet. And for some people, the reasoning and moral judgement centers of the brain aren't fully developed until mid to late 20's.

I'm not saying any of that is an excuse for bad behavior of course. Just that your hatred seems to be stemming at least partially from your expectations of their maturity, which may be a bit high for people still so young. People who go around overdosing on drugs and spending time in jail aren't stable and mature, but why are you expecting them to be? They'll have to grow up and learn by experience like everyone else, and there's nothing you can do to speed up that process. It's not your responsibility. Your only responsibility is to be the best person you can be. A good start might be to relax your expectations, stop allowing yourself to be part of the problem (hatred is never part of the solution) and adopt more of a "Live and let live" philosophy. You will never make the world a just place where everyone does what you think they should, so there's honestly no sense stewing over the fact. It will do nothing but eat you up inside. If you want to make the world a fairer place, then instead of wasting hatred on those who do the wrong thing and get away with it, put yourself to good use loving and defending those who need an ally against cruelty. If you want to fight against the bad, then be your personal best and lead by example. The rest of the world is not on your shoulders, and if you try to put it there, it will crush you.

 

[TheSkaFish]

Yes, but young adults are more likely to make dumb moves in the name of rebellion.

I'm not saying any of that is an excuse for bad behavior of course. Just that your hatred seems to be stemming at least partially from your expectations of their maturity, which may be a bit high for people still so young. People who go around overdosing on drugs and spending time in jail aren't stable and mature, but why are you expecting them to be?

Honestly I think it's her who's the one making dumb moves in the name of rebellion but that's another story. She doesn't get along with her parents, maybe she thinks she's getting back at them in some way. I don't know. She also gets into these depressions and had problems of her own. But I liked her for the way she was to me.

As far as the expectations of maturity go, I don't expect any maturity out of him. I know it's cruel to say, but that guy can get thrown in jail or OD in a ditch and rot for all I care. I have zero sympathy for that piece of trash. He's the enemy. Everything was great until he entered the picture. Maybe if he had gone to jail, things would have been different. It's her who I expected to be more mature, because she was. She was really intelligent for her age. I remember when I got mad about something and I said I'd wished I'd slugged someone, and she told me not to worry and not to waste my existence on things like that. She was always giving me pointers and trying to help me find my path, and told me she cared. She also told me that she used to hang out with people she didn't really think were good friends, but that they were her only friends and they gave her free drinks. And that she didn't hang out with them anymore, and that she wished I lived closer. So I thought it meant she'd grown out of being friends with people just to drink and do whatever else. I guess not.

You will never make the world a just place where everyone does what you think they should, so there's honestly no sense stewing over the fact. It will do nothing but eat you up inside. If you want to make the world a fairer place, then instead of wasting hatred on those who do the wrong thing and get away with it, put yourself to good use loving and defending those who need an ally against cruelty. If you want to fight against the bad, then be your personal best and lead by example. The rest of the world is not on your shoulders, and if you try to put it there, it will crush you.

Well, that's the thing. I've felt that already. Over this year, there's been some days where I've just been mad about this all day. I don't do anything but imagine myself kicking the **** out of this guy. Or I don't think anything, and am just zombified and exhausted.

I guess it's all I can do. I admit I wasn't being the best version of myself when I met her. And it is very, very tiring to stay this angry. I can't even think real thoughts when I get wound up. I feel like I've done something intensely strenuous, but I haven't, I've just been mad. It's heavy.

 

[VanillaCreme]

People at that age are into crime and criminals and rebellion, whether it's justified or not.

People can be into crime at any age. Criminal activities don't stop when we hit 30.

---

Honestly I think it's her who's the one making dumb moves in the name of rebellion but that's another story. She doesn't get along with her parents, maybe she thinks she's getting back at them in some way. I don't know. She also gets into these depressions and had problems of her own. But I liked her for the way she was to me.

As far as the expectations of maturity go, I don't expect any maturity out of him. I know it's cruel to say, but that guy can get thrown in jail or OD in a ditch and rot for all I care. I have zero sympathy for that piece of trash. He's the enemy. Everything was great until he entered the picture. Maybe if he had gone to jail, things would have been different. It's her who I expected to be more mature, because she was. She was really intelligent for her age. I remember when I got mad about something and I said I'd wished I'd slugged someone, and she told me not to worry and not to waste my existence on things like that. She was always giving me pointers and trying to help me find my path, and told me she cared. She also told me that she used to hang out with people she didn't really think were good friends, but that they were her only friends and they gave her free drinks. And that she didn't hang out with them anymore, and that she wished I lived closer. So I thought it meant she'd grown out of being friends with people just to drink and do whatever else. I guess not.

Many people don't get along with their parents. What's that have anything to do with it? And what's wrong with being friends with people who drinking? Drinking isn't immoral. It's not illegal here anymore. Not a crime.

 

[Solivagant]

Honestly I think it's her who's the one making dumb moves in the name of rebellion but that's another story.

Yes, I was referring to her as well.

And it is very, very tiring to stay this angry. I can't even think real thoughts when I get wound up. I feel like I've done something intensely strenuous, but I haven't, I've just been mad. It's heavy.

Emotions can be mentally and physically draining, so that's not surprising.

I wish I could be of more help. I guess all I can do is wish you well and hope you find your way.

 

[TheSkaFish]

People can be into crime at any age. Criminal activities don't stop when we hit 30.

True, but I just feel that at the age of late teens, early 20s, there's this glamorization of rebellion and drugs and crime, more so than later.

Many people don't get along with their parents. What's that have anything to do with it? And what's wrong with being friends with people who drinking? Drinking isn't immoral. It's not illegal here anymore. Not a crime.

Nothing is wrong with drinking in and of itself, as long as you understand you're responsible for your actions and don't do something stupid. Hell, I could use a drink right this minute. I wasn't saying there is anything wrong with drinking.

What I was saying was, she told me she used to be friends with a group of people that she felt were bad friends, but who provided her liquor for free, so she tolerated their company for that reason. She then said she didn't hang out with them anymore, so I thought it meant she had matured enough to no longer hang out with people she didn't even enjoy for the sole reason of drinking.

---

Yes, I was referring to her as well.

Oh, I wasn't sure.

Emotions can be mentally and physically draining, so that's not surprising.

I wish I could be of more help. I guess all I can do is wish you well and hope you find your way.

Thanks, I suppose. It comes and goes. Some days are better than others. Honestly, I was doing pretty well lately until I read this thread and I was reminded, and it kinda re-opened the wound. Some days I manage to distract myself. I really don't want to give up on her, I keep hoping she'll snap out of it some day and I'll be in control of my life and a more interesting, attractive person. If that happened and we agreed to never speak of this again I'd forgive her. Idk. I don't want to give up but if I keep thinking about it, I lose the ability to function. I need to just...put it down, for now before it flattens me.

At least I'm going to a party tomorrow. Haven't been out in weeks.

 

[Pike Creek]

I never liked facial hair on a guy before. I just didn't find it attractive. Especially a mustache. I figured only Tom Selleck could pull that off! But my bf has a scruffy mustache/beard look and I find it very handsome, and it feels good when his face is on my skin too.

I like tattoos, I'm an art-lover - in all its forms. I wouldn't be attracted to facial tattoos though. I have tattoos, one is an elaborate skull with a knife image, I'm certainly not a bad-*** and I love alternative, punk and metal, but I also love jazz and ambient...so go figure. I love skulls, I think they are fascinating, and I plan to get some more tattoos done next summer when I find some more skull images that suit me. If my bf wanted to get some too, I'd be all for it.

My late grandfather had some tattoos he got while he was in the army, arms full of them. He was the most gentle, sweet and caring man I've ever met. He also had a little soul patch and a mustache. If someone said something meritless about him based on his tattoos..it wouldn't be good. We cannot judge other people's fashion/looks/preferences based on one person who caused us pain, I'm sorry to say but that way of thinking needs a lot of maturity.

 

[TheSkaFish]

I like tattoos, I'm an art-lover - in all its forms. I wouldn't be attracted to facial tattoos though. I have tattoos, one is an elaborate skull with a knife image, I'm certainly not a bad-*** and I love alternative, punk and metal, but I also love jazz and ambient...

I'm actually something of a punk rock fan myself. Operation Ivy and Rancid are some of the reasons I picked up a guitar in the first place.

My late grandfather had some tattoos he got while he was in the army, arms full of them. He was the most gentle, sweet and caring man I've ever met. He also had a little soul patch and a mustache. If someone said something meritless about him based on his tattoos..it wouldn't be good. We cannot judge other people's fashion/looks/preferences based on one person who caused us pain, I'm sorry to say but that way of thinking needs a lot of maturity.

Like you said though, he was a good person. I wouldn't have said bad things about him, because he didn't do bad things. What I'm talking about is someone who goes for a "badass" image, and actually does bad things. But because he has this image, which the thread suggests is attractive, it makes up for the fact that this guy does some very wrong behavior. That's what bothers me.

I'm sorry if what I've said offends you, especially cause I like the way you think on some things.

I just really don't like "badasses" though.

 

[Pike Creek]

Like you said though, he was a good person. I wouldn't have said bad things about him, because he didn't do bad things. What I'm talking about is someone who goes for a "badass" image, and actually does bad things. That's what bothers me.

I don't like the image of the "bad-***" either, man or woman, I find it boring and unattractive. My judgement or opinion of a person is definitely based on their character, how they act and what they say.

 

[TheSkaFish]

I don't like the image of the "bad-***" either, man or woman, I find it boring and unattractive.

I wish more women thought like you. Unfortunately, the majority, even otherwise very intelligent ones, see it as a turn-on. You'd think they'd be able to see through the "badass" act.

 

[VanillaCreme]

I don't like the image of the "bad-***" either, man or woman, I find it boring and unattractive.

I wish more women thought like you. Unfortunately, the majority, even otherwise very intelligent ones, see it as a turn-on. You'd think they'd be able to see through the "badass" act.

That's just what you think. Your perception really is your reality. One equals all for you. Just because people don't say outright they don't like something doesn't mean they do like it. You don't know everyone's thoughts on the subject.

 

[Pike Creek]

The stereotype of young girls only attracted to the bad boy has been around for ages. I could say just as easily that men will pass over the mousy brunette for the bouncy blonde with double D's. It's a stereotype that people assume is fact based on a few examples in real life. It leads to generalization and can make a person closed-minded, missing really good opportunities - not just in romance, but every area in life.

If a girl decides she wants a "bad-***" as a boyfriend, that's her choice. We don't know what happens behind closed doors, he could actually be a very sweet guy in private. And some girls get star-struck for the celebrities, bad boys or not, but don't always seek out that type in real life, even though it may seem they go gaga over them.

With life experience and maturity, sometimes people change their tastes, sometimes they don't. I think what's important is finding your own style, being proud of who you are and if it attracts the person you like, great, if it doesn't, look for someone else or make yourself over; but I would suggest not to harbour bitterness and hurt, it's a waste of time and it shows in your personality as jealousy, which I don't think is an attractive quality in any man or woman. I'm using "you" and "your" as a global pronoun.

 

[TheSkaFish]

If a girl decides she wants a "bad-***" as a boyfriend, that's her choice. We don't know what happens behind closed doors, he could actually be a very sweet guy in private. And some girls get star-struck for the celebrities, bad boys or not, but don't always seek out that type in real life, even though it may seem they go gaga over them.

Again though, I think we can safely say that a stable, good, and sweet guy doesn't OD and almost go to prison. I may not be the picture of success but I'll be damned if anyone thinks I'm less of a man than that. I hold that view very strongly and that is something I will not budge on. Someone can look any way they want, but when they do actual bad things, they're a bad guy.

With life experience and maturity, sometimes people change their tastes, sometimes they don't. I think what's important is finding your own style, being proud of who you are and if it attracts the person you like, great, if it doesn't, look for someone else or make yourself over; but I would suggest not to harbour bitterness and hurt, it's a waste of time and it shows in your personality as jealousy, which I don't think is an attractive quality in any man or woman. I'm using "you" and "your" as a global pronoun.

Well, in terms of my own style and making myself over, looking over my wants, it seems that the intelligent, adventurous, passionate girls I go for tend to gravitate towards these "badasses" for some reason. More normal women don't. But then, it's me who's not interested in them. I like the more adventurous girls...but the ones who are aligned with me are, well, they're nice and safe but they don't really do much beyond the usual bars, restaurants, sporting events and TV merry-go-round. They're too low-key for me.

I don't want a rebel, I don't want to be a rebel myself, but I don't want to be too normal or want anyone too normal either. I admit it's a weird position my tastes put me in.

It's like I'm caught in limbo between what I want in a woman, and who I am actually aligned with. I wonder if there isn't a way to attract such a woman without being a "badass". Some way to provide interest and excitement and energy and passion, but without the same destructive macho "rebel" personality.

 

[VanillaCreme]

"Badass" guys aren't the only men with women. Are your views really that misconstrued that you don't realize that? I get your frustration. Really, I do. I've been the person that it seemed like no one wanted. I've been told, flat-out, that I was ugly and that no one would want me. I'm not the ideal woman either. But there are no set rules in life. There's no laws on who someone can and can't be with. What if this girl you like isn't with the guy because he's a "badass" but because she actually genuinely likes him. You don't have to understand why she likes him. That's only for her to understand. He might not even know himself. You're not dating him, so why do you care if he's a badass. You're so absorbed into this.

 

[TheSkaFish]

"Badass" guys aren't the only men with women.

No, but they are the guys who get to choose who they are with. It seems that non-"badass" guys have to content themselves with whoever will take them, regardless of what they want. So I'm trying to figure out how I can avoid settling, but without having to turn into a macho jerk. I don't want to get stuck in a life of quiet desperation.

You're not dating him, so why do you care if he's a badass. You're so absorbed into this.

I'm absorbed because I still fully intend to beat this guy in the end. I want to get things to go back to how they were, where she always wanted me around and we were connecting. I figured out how I messed up with her now, and why it turned out this way. And I know what I can do to fix it. He's not the richest, most interesting, most accomplished, coolest guy on Earth. He can be defeated, shown up, made obsolete. I know I can be a better guy than him if I just figure it out.

 

[TheRealCallie]

 

[EveWasFramed]

^^ Yes, I agree.

 

[VanillaCreme]

"Badass" guys aren't the only men with women.

No, but they are the guys who get to choose who they are with. It seems that non-"badass" guys have to content themselves with whoever will take them, regardless of what they want. So I'm trying to figure out how I can avoid settling, but without having to turn into a macho jerk. I don't want to get stuck in a life of quiet desperation.

You're not dating him, so why do you care if he's a badass. You're so absorbed into this.

I'm absorbed because I still fully intend to beat this guy in the end. I want to get things to go back to how they were, where she always wanted me around and we were connecting. I figured out how I messed up with her now, and why it turned out this way. And I know what I can do to fix it. He's not the richest, most interesting, most accomplished, coolest guy on Earth. He can be defeated, shown up, made obsolete. I know I can be a better guy than him if I just figure it out.

They aren't the only ones who get to decide who they're with. You get to do that too. But your hang up is wanting to be with someone who doesn't want you. Does what she want not matter? You probably won't answer that question because you fail to see other people's side, and you'll manage to flip around words in order for them to work for you.

I don't think you messed up with her. I think she found someone she wanted to be with, and that person isn't you. He's a person just like you are. Not an obsolete object that you can erase from this earth simply because you think he's worthless.

 

[Pike Creek]

Again though, I think we can safely say that a stable, good, and sweet guy doesn't OD and almost go to prison.

Here's something personal that I don't mind sharing since I'm anonymous here. I nearly OD'd twice during a time where I was hooked on a needle drug. Those days are well past me. I also got a warning one time from the police (back in the drug days) for threatening my ex-boss with a knife. I did MANY things that nearly drove me to prison too.

I KNOW I'm a stable, good and sweet woman now, I cannot erase who I was, but anyone who will judge me for what I've done isn't worth my time. I understand where your hurt feelings are coming from and why you are mad at that particular guy. You have a right to hate whomever you want; but sometimes you generalize so much that you don't realize you are being insulting to other people who don't deserve your hatred. I don't know you, so this is just based on the text you type here. I think you're a nice guy, but you wear a chip on your shoulder that is so apparent, I hope you take action to get rid of it. That is heartfelt advice btw, there is nothing angry or demeaning about my response.