How Do You Find the Shy, Loving, Caring, Romantic, & Faithful SO

Loneliness, Depression & Relationship Forum

Help Support Loneliness, Depression & Relationship Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
oopsiedoop said:
But, I just had to say, I am in mourning right now for a relationship with a guy who almost always agreed with me, listened to me for HOURS, gave me thoughtful gifts, but/and who IN FOUR YEARS never made more than half-hearted gestures of anything but friendship.

Wait.. let me get this straight...

So a man being supportive, listening to you for hours, and giving gifts doesn't count as anything more than half-hearted friendship?

Jesus ****, woman. What the hell would this guy hafta do to get your attention? I'd say that from your OWN DESCRIPTION of him, he went above and beyond friendship duties and proved himself one of the best you may ever run into.
 
Badjedidude said:
oopsiedoop said:
But, I just had to say, I am in mourning right now for a relationship with a guy who almost always agreed with me, listened to me for HOURS, gave me thoughtful gifts, but/and who IN FOUR YEARS never made more than half-hearted gestures of anything but friendship.

Wait.. let me get this straight...

So a man being supportive, listening to you for hours, and giving gifts doesn't count as anything more than half-hearted friendship?

Jesus ****, woman. What the hell would this guy hafta do to get your attention? I'd say that from your OWN DESCRIPTION of him, he went above and beyond friendship duties and proved himself one of the best you may ever run into.

Psht. Judging by that description I'd say the dude was a ***** xD Any person who will not only listen to someone's incessant rambling and bitching, but also agrees with everything they say and buys them gifts that are meaningful? Pshaw. Dude was whipped.

In any case, if a person only sees you as a friend then there ain't nothing you can do about it. It's not about being half-hearted, it's that everyone has their own preferences. I can't stand those psycho chicks who are just like "I LOVE YOU BUT YOU ONLY SEE ME AS A FRIEND **** YOU."
If I had a friend like the one described, and come to think of it I probably do (more or less), I'd feel pretty damn lucky...then I'd proceed to call him a woman. :D
 
oopsiedoop said:
Also, regarding animals, ******* just stand there while one male after another has sex with her. No running away. And isn't it the female cats who cry so loudly all night in the alley while they're in heat? And not cause they're *******! Plus, the most important feature is that males don't usually, or as often, certainly, try to mate with females when the female is not in heat. And in most species, the male does something or has some feature to attract females. I haven't studied this, I've just noticed these things, so I may be interpreting things incorrectly. But I've noticed that it could be seen as female biology which determines or even initiates mating to a large degree.

Mishka is essentially correct, though.

While there's usually some form of estrous cycle in female mammals, but male members are always the gender that competes and pursues, often violently. Most male mammals don't show much interest in females not in heat indeed - there's no real biological reason for it; it'll be a waste of effort.

Unfortunately or otherwise, many evidently intelligent or 'advanced' mammals increasingly have males that essentially force females to have sex with them with visibly violent behavior. If new lion takes over a pride of lionnesses, he typically slaughters the cubs so that the females come into estrus again; lion males occasionally even attack and kill females outright, which is incredibly maladaptive behavior. Dolphin males often essentially practice a form of gang ****. Chimpanzees actually engage in a basic form of warfare to take over ownership of females. Even house cats fight over the female, and their penii is barbed such that the act of mating is painful for the female. Wolves are among the most lethal and simply kill off rival males - besides human beings, wolves are common intraspecies killers.

Pair-bounding isn't very common for social mammals; some form of polygamy often is and it rewards the 'most fit' male at the expense of 'less fit' males overall. The reverse, polyandry, is extremely rare. If its a social group with an alpha male, then he will typically mate with all or almost all females in the group.

Human females don't have an obvious estrous signals like most primates do, instead displaying markers of estrous at all times: secondary sexual characteristics such as breasts and hips(and perhaps why men are almost genetically programmed to find those fascinating). There are some theories why this is so; the one I lean toward is that by appearing 'available' at all times, primordial females gained the advantage of male protection and support by apparently being reproductively valuable at all times.

At any rate, early human societies do seem to affirm Mishka's thesis: bride capture is common in most tribal societies and in almost every patrilineal society(which would be most), it is also a patriarchy; basically, in other ways, in every society where men tend to claim ownership of their children, they also claim the majority of power. This patriarchy is usually exacerbated with increasing wealth: !kung-bushmen and hunting-gathering tribes that live on essentially a sustenance level of existence have division of labor but little gender structure, while chiefdoms and feudal states with higher overall wealth display vast gender inequalities while encouraging ambitious and aggressive men as can be witnessed in the appearance of social structures such as polygamy.

There are exceptions, but those are rare and often feature astounding ignorance: there's one tribe that does not connect conception with sex - sex is just practiced generally and birth is seen as a magical occurrence. Since men are not aware of their exact contribution to the descent nor of paternity of children, all resources are simply allocated to the general upbringing of children and their mothers.

tl;dr version: humans probably do have some biological programming in us, but we're very socially developed creatures as well. Essentially, expect us to all be rather confused with many different signals firing off in our brains :p
 
Badjedidude:

Your post actually made me feel good. It's what I want to hear. Believe me, I spent four years analyzing his every word and gesture, and two months now that I stopped talking to him after he announced he's moving to another country going over it all again and again..and again and again and again..it's all I think about..I have to stop. What does everyone here think about the book "He's Just Not That Into You"? Experience had led me to that conclusion before it came out. When a guy is really into you, he lets you know in no uncertain terms. Yeah, maybe you don't approach certain women, but that's because they aren't gravitating anything back. Like I said, I go over this again and again in my mind, if he might have seen it that way. But that was hardly the case. Plus, one issue that took over the whole relationship was that when we first met, I was uncharacteristically forward and told him I thought he was so cute and suggested we go out and was very quick to respond to him when he contacted me, but none of these were ever reciprocated.

Now, while all that is material for the mill that male choice is at the heart of mating, I have to disagree that the descriptions in IgnoredOne's post do. They are descriptions where males fight each other, not where they dominate females. The one sentence about how they kill them sometimes has no relationship to anything else in it, so you'd have to explain it to me.
 
oopsiedoop said:
Now, while all that is material for the mill that male choice is at the heart of mating, I have to disagree that the descriptions in IgnoredOne's post do. They are descriptions where males fight each other, not where they dominate females. The one sentence about how they kill them sometimes has no relationship to anything else in it, so you'd have to explain it to me.

What is an useful personality trait to have if as a male, fighting is expected? Aggression.

The throwaway note of lions actually attacking lionnesses shows just how valuable aggression is biased for - attacking females is NEVER EVER positive for the male; he is essentially injuring the prospects of his future children, since not only is the potentially injured female less likely to gestate his progeny successfully, but since parental duties are usually assumed by the mother, he is also diminishing the prospects of his progeny being successfully raised.

The very fact that such behavior even persists in the wild shows just how heavily aggression is biased for. Most likely its just a side effect of what gives males aggression against her males, and it is sometimes misdirected toward females.

The tl;dr of it is that assertion/aggressive behavior is often a marker of successful males in nature, this may also be why confidence is seen as attractive in humans.

I can elaborate a lot further, but I'm running low on sleep and caffiene. I should also add that in no way should any statement I make be considered as anything more than general; even within a species there are variations(lionnesses do sometimes protect their cubs from new males, for example), and no axiom that applies to all mammals would be true.

And I'm not sure about male choice. Given the option, as I mentioned, most males with the capability eventually mate with /all/ available females. That's not very specific discrimination.
 
It's not the only factor becuase I'm human.

Never the less Renae bare my child.
And a stronge driving force for her to take care of my child.

Yes...there's also that instent connection, chemistry, Reane and I have
from the moment we met.

Yes, also true...and it dosnrt matter of the woman is pretty, nice or not nice...
If i'm not attracted to her...I'm not attacted to her.
She can be even better looking than Reane or the pretties women or a love goddess to other men

And it dosnt have anything to do with...I think she's too good for me.
I've been with plenty of drop dead goregouse kind loving women.
If there's not that chemistry...there's not.

Renae and I are probably 90% alike.
Same type of beliefs. Lots of the same interest. Lots of the same traits.
 
I'm really interested in knowing how you know all of this IgnoredOne. Like, did you spend a lot of time on wikipedia one day because you were bored, or was this one of the electives university made you take alongside your actual degree?
 
And yes...for me its true.
Im an T and A kind of guy.
99% of the women Ive been with has big ****s. And I nice toosh.

Plus that walk...the ways she wiggle her hip when she walks...Not all women have that type of walk....
My ex wf has that same sexy walk
Its almost like a fetish kind of thing for me. The type of walk I fine sexy and it drives me crazy...

If I prioritize the reasons why Im attracted to certain women.The sexy walk would be way...way on top of the list..

Plus her vioce.

I can try to tell you that I would make my decions other wise so I might not sound sexest
But The truth is...my decions malking or process are base on these things.

Err...wtf
The lion king thing was just a joke. That becuase Renae and I are both Lios..lmao
It's the alignement of the stars...man.
It's fate....
 
Limlim said:
I'm really interested in knowing how you know all of this IgnoredOne. Like, did you spend a lot of time on wikipedia one day because you were bored, or was this one of the electives university made you take alongside your actual degree?

I MUST KNOW EVERYTHING.

Anyway, you might want to look up Professor Rob Engen, who participates in military history research at Queens University in Canada and is a close friend of mine(we kinda grew up together in a way). I helped him a bit on a paper to refute Lt. Col. Dave Grossman's moronic 'killology' research which appeared in the Canadian Military Journal. Part of it was to detail evidence of warfare in the animal world, which he had gathered a nice little collection for and I was able to help connect my friend of mine who helped dispute there was any biological evidence to Grossman's assertions. Really, I think we were trying to find ways of saying to Grossman of "HELLO *****, YOUR FACE MEET CURB! REPEATEDLY!" in a way that is still acceptable to academia, military academia as it might be.

LTC Grossman actually responded in a rebuttal, which made us pretty happy that we actually bothered him given his credentials and all jibberjabber. Just so much ******* lies.
 
Doubt The Rabbit said:
Dude was whipped.

Apparently not. Whatever "whipped" is supposed to mean.

Doubt The Rabbit said:
In any case, if a person only sees you as a friend then there ain't nothing you can do about it.

You don't say.

Doubt The Rabbit said:
It's not about being half-hearted, it's that everyone has their own preferences.

Well, I didn't get to the half hearted part, but yeah, everyone has their own preferences. Some good guys like bad girls. In fact, quite a few ;) And some good girls like bad boys. And .. well you don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out all the permutations on your own.

Doubt The Rabbit said:
I can't stand those psycho chicks who are just like "I LOVE YOU BUT YOU ONLY SEE ME AS A FRIEND **** YOU."

What bothered me actually was that he saw me as a girl. And I was like, hey, if I'm going to be the girl, I better get what a girl is supposed to get.

Doubt The Rabbit said:
If I had a friend like the one described, and come to think of it I probably do (more or less), I'd feel pretty damn lucky...then I'd proceed to call him a woman. :D

Glad you appreciate women. I did feel lucky until that male/female conversation we had.

IgnoredOne:

I think you're doing a great job at proving what we all know, that aggression is stupid, and that bad guys are just bad, not attractive.
 
FunkyBuddha said:
IgnoredOne said:
Actually, my point was exactly the opposite, but okay.


Not entirely sure why you bother sometimes...


You must bear in mind that reason rarely affects romantics...

:p

Honestly, I wonder too.

An early version of cognitive dissonance theory appeared in Leon Festinger's 1956 book, When Prophecy Fails. This book gave an inside account of the increasing belief which sometimes follows the failure of a cult's prophecy. The believers met at a pre-determined place and time, believing they alone would survive the Earth's destruction. The appointed time came and passed without incident. They faced acute cognitive dissonance: had they been the victim of a hoax? Had they donated their worldly possessions in vain? Most members chose to believe something less dissonant: the aliens had given earth a second chance, and the group was now empowered to spread the word: earth-spoiling must stop. The group dramatically increased their proselytism despite the failed prophecy - Wikipedia

I think it has a strong correlation with an emotional version of the economic concept of sunk costs, and its fallacies.
 
IgnoredOne said:
I think it has a strong correlation with an emotional version of the economic concept of sunk costs, and its fallacies.


I'd have to agree.

Acting adversely under the psychological effects of a 'sunk cost' relationship would make returning to an abusive spouse almost rational in a victim's mind. Especially when coupling the conflicting ideals they would certainly have after vesting so much into the relationship already, yet no longer wanting to get hurt.

When in reality they should certainly cut their losses.

If I've missed something feel free to enlighten me. :D
 
Jesus Christ...someone Googled
what someone wrote about their fuicken idea of theres not a GOD.

Let me get thid straight???
Im suppost to believe whatever ****
someone wrote becuase soemone look up to that someone or thinks they.re smarter and have the fucken answeers for me?

What if I think Im smarter than all those stupid sons of *******? :p

Its not fucken rocket sceince.lmao

What I wanna know is....
Had any of those dudes know how to really..really give a nice girl what she reslly really wants without being to damn shy about it..
Yes...yes..Jenifer was a very very nice girl...at the sametime she was really really a bad girl in bed :p

If you it right...shell walk around with a twingle in her eyes for a couple of days..and do antything and everythng for ya. LoL
 
FunkyBuddha said:
IgnoredOne said:
I think it has a strong correlation with an emotional version of the economic concept of sunk costs, and its fallacies.


I'd have to agree.

Acting adversely under the psychological effects of a 'sunk cost' relationship would make returning to an abusive spouse almost rational in a victim's mind. Especially when coupling the conflicting ideals they would certainly have after vesting so much into the relationship already, yet no longer wanting to get hurt.

When in reality they should certainly cut their losses.

If I've missed something feel free to enlighten me. :D

Indeed; and I think this also applies to a lot of opinions as well.

Once people have an opinion - virtually any opinion, they will selectively view any evidence they see in a position most favorable to their opinion. My theory here is that they've 'sunk' so much of their mental energy in continuing that line of thought that it becomes irrationally more comfortable to remain in that line of thought.

Confirmation bias(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias) is a great conceptualization of it, but what really interesting is when evidence is /entirely/ against the individual in the example I posted. With such vast cognitive dissonance, most people nonetheless cling to their previous beliefs and reinforce them, despite the complete lack of objective reality to them.

It becomes a part of their identity and anything that chips at it attacks their self-esteem, and therefore must be rejected.

Being sociopathic and Myers Brigg INTJ, I'm characterized by utiliarian attitudes and harsh tendency to judge both myself and others by concrete results. I think that is why I've avoided this bias to greater extent; I'm not really attached to anything except what works.

You can definitely notice this paradigm in effect with LC, though really, I don't see any reason to bother anymore as you said. To each has his own, and I suppose, they all have a role in the world.

Anyway, we deviated significantly. PM me if you want to talk more about the beauties of cognitive dissonance.
 
IgnoredOne said:
Anyway, we deviated significantly. PM me if you want to talk more about the beauties of cognitive dissonance.

Thank god! I doubt the OP wants to see any more at work!
 
This was my real question, but I was too emotional at the time to present the question appropriately.

oopsiedoop said:
Wow, so much to say. I think the essence of the OP is why would someone prefer to be with someone who doesn't treat them well when someone who does is available ...

I have enjoyed reading the responses no matter the direction it took.:)

Please feel free to continue to share.


oopsiedoop said:
IgnoredOne said:
Anyway, we deviated significantly. PM me if you want to talk more about the beauties of cognitive dissonance.

Thank god! I doubt the OP wants to see any more at work!

 

Latest posts

Back
Top