Is starting later an advantage or disadvantage?

[ardour]

Actually, there are plenty of women who are older who haven't been in a relationship. They tend to be either socially awkward or unattractive, though, which is what guys with the same situations go through.

I'll assume you have come across a lot of these women in real life, so then it's a case of your experiences differing. Of course they exist, I didn't say they didn't, but in fewer numbers IMO.

Almost all the women I work around are married, and I work in LIBRARY! Speaking of highly introverted people - right here, Ground Zero.
In contrast the great majority of men who work here are single.

 

[Locke]

Women are more emotionally prepared to be alone than men, that's the problem. Sorry another gender war post.

I have no idea if that is true or not. But one of the problems with generalizations like that is, a lonely woman probably doesn't care if most of her gender is able to deal with loneliness better than she can. Why would she take comfort from that? If anything, it might make her feel worse. So to me, in a forum where everyone is lonely, it does come off a little as a gender war post.

But if it is true, and there are statistics or evidence to support it, then there are still too many other things to factor in. Like how women sometimes make less money than men doing the same job, so they might be less financially secure if alone later in life. Or how throughout history, women were often treated as lesser beings (still are, in some places).

I'm not trying to be a white knight on behalf of women, I've kind of thought the same before. I guess I'm just not a fan of generalizations and statistics, and I probably shouldn't even throw my two cents in. I'm just saying that men and women both have their crosses to bare. If more men are lonely, then its something that we have to deal with, just like there are things that women have to deal with.

 

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

Actually, there are plenty of women who are older who haven't been in a relationship. They tend to be either socially awkward or unattractive, though, which is what guys with the same situations go through.

I'll assume you have come across a lot of these women in real life, so then it's a case of your experiences differing. Of course they exist, I didn't say they didn't, but in fewer numbers IMO.

Almost all the women I work around are married, and I work in LIBRARY! Speaking of highly introverted people - right here, Ground Zero.
In contrast the great majority of men who work here are single.

You're assuming that librarians are a certain type of person.

In fact, a lot of bookish librarian guys get married, because they find likeminded people who frequent those places. I've often wondered if I'd increase my chances if I worked at a library, because women who are readers are generally more intelligent than someone who frequents a rock concert.

 

[ardour]

But I don't just assume, I speak from experience. Of where I work at least.

There are plenty of introverted Plain Janes here who nonetheless have loving husbands.

And introverted, 'plain', single, inexperienced men. (no I haven't asked them all regarding their pasts, but it would be fairly obvious to most people that this were the case)

 

[Revengineer]

But I don't just assume, I speak from experience. Of where I work at least.

There are plenty of introverted Plain Janes here who nonetheless have loving husbands.

And introverted, 'plain', single, inexperienced men. (no I haven't asked them all regarding their pasts, but it would be fairly obvious to most people that this were the case)

Two points:

1. In a society with even gender ratios and a vast acceptance of monogamous relationships, there will always be as many single women as single men. So numbers aren't the issue here. The problem may be your limited perspective.

2. I think for guys especially, having a relationship becomes a social status thing. Traditionally it's the male's responsibility to "get" a girlfriend, and not having one means he's "failed" as a man. To be fair women experience some version of this too, but not as universally. So if there's a reason why lonely men seem more desperate and vocal on this forum, that's probably why.

 

[edamame721]

As someone who is starting "later" I wish I had begun earlier and been allowed to make mistakes, but that said, I don't know how well I would have coped. You don't only get to understand people through romantic relationships, but in how you deal with everyone else: family, friends, co-workers.

I think the only real dangers in starting later are: Feeling pessimistic about finding someone to the point you shut out anyone new or building a fantasy that no one can live up to.

 

[Minus]

But I don't just assume, I speak from experience. Of where I work at least.

In the prior place where i worked, in our small group there were four females in their late 30s to early 40s who were single and always had been. That did not apply to any of the males.

If i were to take this limited experience and make universal statements based on it, then they would negate the universal claims that you are making based on your equally limited sampling.

 

[ardour]

1. In a society with even gender ratios and a vast acceptance of monogamous relationships, there will always be as many single women as single men. So numbers aren't the issue here. The problem may be your limited perspective.

I'm not retarded, I get that the numbers of single men and women must be about equal.

What we're talking about is a total lack of experience, and a seeming disparity in this between men and women. I've heard this over and over again really. Everyone knows virgin guys who have never had girlfriends, but the equivalent in women are like an endangered species you might hear about but only get a rare glimpse of. Obvious explanations would be female hypergamy and much discussed lopsided expectations around dating. So that's why I mention the shy awkward married women, contrasting shy, awkward single men. True this is from a limited, and admittedly biased perspective... so I shall leave it there. It would be every interesting if there were some valid research/surveying on this, but I can't find any. I only have experience/intuition but I'm not the only one here who sees it.

..that being the majority of women NOT lacking for male attention. Sincere non-objectifying attention included. Whether those men meet the standards and the attention is wanted is another thing.

 

[ardour]

.. on topic.

If first and second times are destined to fail ‘dry runs’ then of course getting them out of the way at a young age is an advantage. The prospect of an ill-fated relationship in my 30s is too much though, so I'll remain naive.

 

[Revengineer]

The big question here is, do these typical early relationships fail because of immaturity or lack of experience? In other words, is "knowing how to date" a prerequisite for a long-lasting relationship?

I think that as long as we know what we're looking for and treat our other half with respect, the dating part will come naturally. Of course figuring out what we want is easier said than done, and having experience helps with that process. Going through drama and breakups sounds like such a waste of time though... if only there were realistic simulators for that kind of stuff.

 

[Locke]

The big question here is, do these typical early relationships fail because of immaturity or lack of experience? In other words, is "knowing how to date" a prerequisite for a long-lasting relationship?

Early relationships fail for a lot of reasons, but I'd imagine those are the biggest ones. I don't think that knowing how to date is a prerequisite, but experience helps. There are things that are more important, though.

 

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

I think what is most frustrating is that the whole self image I had of being a loving boyfriend has been drained out of me. I don't see myself being as successful in relationships as I was when I was, say, 17. 13 years of loneliness has convinced me that nobody will ever love me like that.

 

[Waffle]

As a girl who started fairly early I wish that I haven't. Being somewhat of a loner and introvert as a teenager I did not feel much pressure to join in the teenage dating games from peers but expectations from parents to be ''normal'' did it.
Ideally for me I was ready to start dating around the time I turned 20 when I felt I was mature enough to find a right person and since then It has not been an issue.
Earlier then that despite what people say is good experience I would toss away any time as it is most certainly not for me; Two half serious attempts feel like a waste of time and delving into something I did not need.

That aside, I prefer men who are shy or introverted (not in a lady submissive way) and tend to gravitate away from those with previous experiences especially from teenage years since from my own experience I consider it immature..
Older man with no dating experience but a kind and loving heart is somewhat of an ideal match (I guess unlike for most ladies based from talks to my female friends).

 

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

Waffle, I've heard this before, but the question is...where are you girls when I'm looking for you? It seems like only the bad girls are around, the nice girls are married or in relationships.

 

[Locke]

They're out there, Muse. I'm seeing a girl who prefers quiet men, and she's pretty quiet herself. Its just hard for two shy people to find each other.

 

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

Its just hard for two shy people to find each other.

Yes, the fact that I'm quiet is probably why I'm alone.

 

[Waffle]

Waffle, I've heard this before, but the question is...where are you girls when I'm looking for you? It seems like only the bad girls are around, the nice girls are married or in relationships.

I think the problem is...since we are all equally quiet/private/introverted/shy........... we can't find each other!
I believe high standards in picking a partner might be an issue too. When you are older and dating you know exactly what you want.. when you are younger and dating you are more prone to experimenting.

I have been lucky before to find nice introverts on art websites. Those weird artsy types tend to often be equally awkward in social settings as loners.

 

[Locke]

Its just hard for two shy people to find each other.

Yes, the fact that I'm quiet is probably why I'm alone.

No, I'm saying that you're probably alone because there's a nice girl out there who'll see what a great guy you are. You just haven't found each other yet.

 

[ardour]

Its just hard for two shy people to find each other.

Yes, the fact that I'm quiet is probably why I'm alone.

No, I'm saying that you're probably alone because there's a nice girl out there who'll see what a great guy you are. You just haven't found each other yet.

Then they get to make sexy time.