Doctors not listening / understanding !

[charlotte craig]

I am 65 and very knowledgeable about certain medical matters since being unwell. When I became unwell about seven years ago the doctors were clueless about what my symptoms pointed to. No idea at all, so waived it all aside. One nurse insisted I was imagining I was ill and had these symptoms. How insulting. I researched on google and eventually pieced it all together. I had an underactive thyroid. I explained this to the doctors and again they shrugged their shoulders, waived it aside, did not want to listen or accept it, but to get rid of me they agreed to the usual blood test and the test showed I was right and needed treatment for it.

Move on and a few years ago I became very ill, all sorts of nasty symptoms that suddenly hit me. I had no idea of what caused them and again I had this shrugging of shoulders.
No idea. Must be nothing attitude. They did some blood tests and said they were fine so this made them more determined to tell me I was imagining things. I insisted on seeing a specialist consultant. Because I had had asthma YEARS AGO the nurse was going to send me to an asthma doctor - which made no sense at all as the symptoms did not include anything connected to asthma. The symptoms were in my arms, legs, body, head etc. I knew it would be a waste of time to go to this doctor - especially as I struggle to travel and this was a long way away. I insisted they send me to a neurologist instead, as some of the symptoms fitted that. The neurologist said they thought I had fibromyalgia and that was it. You are left to deal with it, you can have pain killers and they offer to let you go to see an exercise specialise who will show you how to move your arms and legs. A very very long journey for that. No thanks I said. I can work out how to move my arms and legs alone, or see it on youtube. I continued to be ill with these symptoms but got more and more symptoms.
Feeling very cold was one of them, so cold I would have to have all the heating on AND stay in bed covered by lots of blankets, including a heated one. Even then still feeling cold.
Back aches, stomach aches, more and more. I insisted they help. They did another blood test. This time it came back as dangerous and urgent and I was told I must urgently go to the
gynocological department at the hospital for further tests. This showed I might have cancer, it turned out it was cysts on my ovary causing all of these symptoms. The symptoms they had told me were in my imagination. I had a total hysterectomy, and felt much better as from day one. Three weeks later I felt awful. Terrible problems with breathing and energy.
Finding it hard to just go upstairs etc. When I told them they started this oh it's your asthma again stuff again. No I said it is not. Again a verbal battle as I got worse and worse.
I had to have an ambulance take me to hospital and was there for a time. My oxygen level very low, which had never happened before and nothing to do with asthma. They had no idea what was causing it and did not care. When I got home I googled it and hey presto. When you no longer have your ovaries or they stop working you can go into an unable to breath weak fatigued mode and need urgent care and medicine - it means you need estrogen. I insisted to the doctors they give me estrogen patches which they did and immediately my breathing and energy got much better. I now have a lot of nasty side effects from the estrogen! Which I need to resolve. And guess what, they are clueless about it again. GERD, acid reflux is one of the symptoms of using hrt patches! Estrogen is very important as you can have a bad memory, concentration and much more without enough of it.

During this time a cousin was told by his doctor to have his gallbladder out. He obediently did it. He now regrets it because he is more ill without it than he was with it.
And there is nothing they can do about it.

When my husband had the same problem this guy had we changed his diet for a month and he was well again. No need for the same operation - despite what the doctor had said.

Another person I know had their prostrate out. Again they are now worse and there is nothing the doctors can do about it.

So beware. Have knowledge. Use the website Earth Clinic for ailments and remedies if you need to learn more about whatever first.Think for yourself. Don't assume the medical person knows what you need or gives good advice.

 

[okidoke]

I hear ya. My new years resolution was to avoid any medical practitioner if possible.

 

[charlotte craig]

Hi there, thanks for the comment. Not always possible to avoid them, but at least don't take their word for it about things, and try to make sure you are well rather than get ill and then have to get well again.

I just read about a guy who got bad lungs and was told he would be dead soon because his lungs were so badly scarred.. The doctor wanted to put him on steroids and have him wait till he died. He was 62. But instead of doing this he took matters into his own hands and used a natural substance through a nebuliser. At the start he struggled to walk upstairs. After a bit of using his nebuliser he was able to walk a mile, then two, then three each day. When he went back to the doctor the doctor did x rays and could not understand how his lungs were now fine. He told the doctor about his natural remedies and the doctor would not accept it and still found fault. Presumably because he was not going to be returning over and over again and spending money on him and dying soon instead.

 

[okidoke]

no, not always possible I know. I'm a heart attack survivor (2014), I have a chronic back injury, I've had other surgical procedures, and have struggled with mental health for 40 years. BUT, once I got fed up with everything in the world and took control of ME, I have striven forward. I eat well and exercise daily, although I have a personal relationship to solve eventually, but I keep occupied with things to keep me on track. I've never been fitter and I'm only only aspirin and a beta blocker, after weaning off several other meds. I still have to see a GP to get my scripts, and I'm getting a skin check next month, but I'll not be taking anything they say as gospel. I research things. I've lost various family members to various ailments and diseases (as we all have) and I aim not to make the same mistakes made with them.

 

[TropicalStarfish]

I wouldn't even begin to know where to start; but, I agree with you about doctors @charlotte craig .

Not to mention if you're lucky enough to even have the kind of insurance that gives you any options, much less any insurance at all, here in the states.

I'd be interested in knowing what your friend was nebulizing that lead to his recovery. As far as my understanding goes, lung scarring doesn't just, 'heal,' as they are scars. Maybe the doc misinterpreted an image or something. I'm not doubting the story or the claim; but, I'd like to know more specifics.

I think, and this is just a guess, that, part of the problem with the entire institution is many-fold.
1: There is so much specialization and bad communication.
1a: Your general practitioner isn't going to meet with a specialist they refer you to, sit down for 2 hours, and really discuss things, much less with you present, and work together till a full hand-off to the specialist is warranted. Some papers will be passed back and forth and that's it.

2: Insurance companies. These guys probably practically own the entire industry. Assuming you had an infinite cash-flow, you could probably influence the best of the best to really ******* pay attention and give you the time of day; but, without that, again, it comes down to mountains of paperwork, rules, regulations, yablahblah, and all of that detracts from doctor-patient relationship.

3: Patient load, as it relates to organizational structure. A good doctor wants to be spending time doing what a doctor is supposed to do; but, these types are probably rare, and even when they present themselves, they have to deal with 1: and 2:, which limits their capacity to communicate both with other doctors, and with the companies responsible for making sure payment issues are addressed.

4: Management and underlings. Lower status workers, such as nurses, and the like, though the profession itself is extremely honorable, are also susceptible to flaws. A nurse might be absolutely terrible at their job or negligent, or even malevolent at worst. And if not that, they may be sub-par, and only doing the absolute minimum required, with no actual passion or interest in what they are doing. And then on top of that, they too, have to deal with communication between the patient and the doctor and play middleman and all sorts of things can get lost in translation.

5: Politics and the work place environment. It usually only takes 1 perfectly placed ******* to make the entire department hell for everyone. And that's not even factoring in sub-optimal working conditions, poor environment in general, bad leadership, bad management, bad crew, etc.. etc..

---
It's a weird world back there. From a certain perspective, I'd say it's almost understandable. It often can be a very high-stress job; but, quite a lot of it is ********, probably the majority. And like any job, often times, the only thing making the job hell is just one perfectly placed arsehole, to create a work-place environment of misery for everyone, because they have some power-trip bug up their ***.

I've heard stories of medical professionals looking down on patients for getting information from the internet; and then I've heard about actual medical professionals not knowing how to do something, and so they look up how to do it on the internet lol. Double standards.

---

I think the main, only, and real problem is, just the current world order and state of affairs. There isn't a shred of honesty or decency left in the business world anymore; and medicine is more business now, than healing art/practice...

In my opinion, getting remittance should be a side effect of being a good healer, not a granted given way into an affluent lifestyle, recognition, or status.

 

[okidoke]

I've heard stories of medical professionals looking down on patients for getting information from the internet; and then I've heard about actual medical professionals not knowing how to do something, and so they look up how to do it on the internet lol.

Oh I've had GP's google things while I sat there next to them lol. I've had ridiculous scripts written out for things that I just threw in the bin. Never needed it and was fine.

 

[charlotte craig]

I wouldn't even begin to know where to start; but, I agree with you about doctors @charlotte craig .

Not to mention if you're lucky enough to even have the kind of insurance that gives you any options, much less any insurance at all, here in the states.

I'd be interested in knowing what your friend was nebulizing that lead to his recovery. As far as my understanding goes, lung scarring doesn't just, 'heal,' as they are scars. Maybe the doc misinterpreted an image or something. I'm not doubting the story or the claim; but, I'd like to know more specifics.

I think, and this is just a guess, that, part of the problem with the entire institution is many-fold.
1: There is so much specialization and bad communication.
1a: Your general practitioner isn't going to meet with a specialist they refer you to, sit down for 2 hours, and really discuss things, much less with you present, and work together till a full hand-off to the specialist is warranted. Some papers will be passed back and forth and that's it.

2: Insurance companies. These guys probably practically own the entire industry. Assuming you had an infinite cash-flow, you could probably influence the best of the best to really ******* pay attention and give you the time of day; but, without that, again, it comes down to mountains of paperwork, rules, regulations, yablahblah, and all of that detracts from doctor-patient relationship.

3: Patient load, as it relates to organizational structure. A good doctor wants to be spending time doing what a doctor is supposed to do; but, these types are probably rare, and even when they present themselves, they have to deal with 1: and 2:, which limits their capacity to communicate both with other doctors, and with the companies responsible for making sure payment issues are addressed.

4: Management and underlings. Lower status workers, such as nurses, and the like, though the profession itself is extremely honorable, are also susceptible to flaws. A nurse might be absolutely terrible at their job or negligent, or even malevolent at worst. And if not that, they may be sub-par, and only doing the absolute minimum required, with no actual passion or interest in what they are doing. And then on top of that, they too, have to deal with communication between the patient and the doctor and play middleman and all sorts of things can get lost in translation.

5: Politics and the work place environment. It usually only takes 1 perfectly placed ******* to make the entire department hell for everyone. And that's not even factoring in sub-optimal working conditions, poor environment in general, bad leadership, bad management, bad crew, etc.. etc..

---
It's a weird world back there. From a certain perspective, I'd say it's almost understandable. It often can be a very high-stress job; but, quite a lot of it is ********, probably the majority. And like any job, often times, the only thing making the job hell is just one perfectly placed arsehole, to create a work-place environment of misery for everyone, because they have some power-trip bug up their ***.

I've heard stories of medical professionals looking down on patients for getting information from the internet; and then I've heard about actual medical professionals not knowing how to do something, and so they look up how to do it on the internet lol. Double standards.

---

I think the main, only, and real problem is, just the current world order and state of affairs. There isn't a shred of honesty or decency left in the business world anymore; and medicine is more business now, than healing art/practice...

In my opinion, getting remittance should be a side effect of being a good healer, not a granted given way into an affluent lifestyle, recognition, or status.

Agree with you on many points. People are unrealistic about doctors. I've met people who think they can research a subject and go to their doctor and leave them with 50 pages of research to read. Like they have the time or inclination. And, of course, they expect all of this time for free too.
I live in the UK so its not about insurance. It's about attitude, knowledge and time. If you go private you see the same person who says and does the same things.

 

[Adamridge79]

I actually read all this, new for me. But, I must be very lucky. As my 'team' continues to grow, they ask their questions, I ask mine. They ask what I think, and of course I tell them. I ask what they think, and they have their own speak, but, I advocate for myself. It may help 2/3 of my peoples are female. But, the massive medical complex I've hated living around is being really helpful, I'm really conflicted. So, I really wish I could commiserate, and it has to suck. But I hope it turns the corner for all you.

 

[charlotte craig]

Have a nice day, thanks.

 

[TheRealCallie]

Um sorry, but they didn't put you on estrogen when you had a hysterectomy? That's pretty common knowledge, so I'm not really sure why they wouldn't.
As for the gall bladder thing, you still have to watch what you eat after you have it removed because you no longer have a gall bladder to filter out the crap. Yes, you can typically control it with diet, but not always.

And the website, I would advise caution on anyone wanting to use that site. I'm not saying the information is necessarily wrong, but the site is low quality.

All in all, doctors don't always get it right and they don't always care, so you should always advocate for yourself. BUT, not everyone knows what to look for and there are a million symptoms that could go with any number of illnesses/diseases, so self diagnosing can sometimes cause more problems for the individual. Everyone should have a doctor that at least tries to listen to their concerns. If you don't have that, you should find one that does.

 

[charlotte craig]

Um sorry, but they didn't put you on estrogen when you had a hysterectomy? That's pretty common knowledge, so I'm not really sure why they wouldn't.
As for the gall bladder thing, you still have to watch what you eat after you have it removed because you no longer have a gall bladder to filter out the crap. Yes, you can typically control it with diet, but not always.

And the website, I would advise caution on anyone wanting to use that site. I'm not saying the information is necessarily wrong, but the site is low quality.

All in all, doctors don't always get it right and they don't always care, so you should always advocate for yourself. BUT, not everyone knows what to look for and there are a million symptoms that could go with any number of illnesses/diseases, so self diagnosing can sometimes cause more problems for the individual. Everyone should have a doctor that at least tries to listen to their concerns. If you don't have that, you should find one that does.

Hi, I live in the UK. No they do not put you on estrogen when you have a hysterectomy. And I do know that when you have your gallbladder removed you have to watch what you eat, I know three people with this problem. They now wished they had not agreed to have it removed. My husband did not have his removed because we changed his diet instead.... seven years ago - he has been fine ever since.

As for if a doctor does not do this and that find another doctor, it is not the same in the UK. You are allocated one by the NHS and if you go private you get the same consultants you get if you go through the NHS. Now you can be told you are getting an urgent appointment and are still waiting for the appointment date a year later.

I've become very much an advocate for healthy eating and trying to prevent becoming ill rather than get ill and then look for help and become helpless or get worse. I know five people who have very bad prostrate problems. All of them struggling and in a mess. I found out that none of them like or ever eat tomatoes, which contain lycopene, which are very good for the prostrate. My husband eats them every day.

I don't agree that self diagnosing causes problems unless you do it quickly and inefficiently. I dont. I take my time and use wisdom. I diagnosed my underactive thyroid, stomach ulcers and much more, no thanks to the doctors at all.

 

[BDLonely]

The last time I saw a nurse, she rushed me and didn't fully listen to me. So when I encounter her again, I'm going to insist she slow down. It's not just doctors.

 

[SquareBin]

is the medical field understaffed everywhere ?

I know in France it's getting bad... tons of "urgence" clinics shutting down temporarily or permanently