Is Spanking Or A Slap To The Face As A Disciplinary Measure Child Abuse?

[SofiasMami]

It's a slippery slope.
My parents spanked me and it didn't do a bit of good.
I've never hit my child and never will.

Teresa

 

[Lonely in BC]

I don't have kids, and I'm happy to leave judgements around discipline in the hands those who do.

This has been said a few posts back. No it doesn't seem appropriate as some lazy go-to punishment for disobedience, or to vent frustration, but it might be valid display of disapproval if things really get out of hand. The "hitting is bad" argument is simplistic, but I guess it's understandable from someone who was hit for just about anything.

It's nice that you have well behaved daughter, but children can't all be the same and your experieces from being on the receiving end of physical punishment aren't applicable to every parent who has ever spanked their kids either.... quite arrogant to think personal experiences are somehow universal.

Sigh....not even sure why I'm bothering to respond to this, maybe it's the meds that have relaxed my reticence tonight.

Thanks for pointing out I'm arrogant (as you define arrogance)- sadly though, this is far from the truth. I chuckled when I read "....quite arrogant to think personal experiences are somehow universal." a few hours after reading your learned declaration "Better an occasional smack than naively raising a sociopath.", unfortunately I'm now confused by your thoughts- would it be correct for me to have the assumption that an occasional (depending on your definition of occasional) smack will prevent someone from being a sociopath? I guess I look at it in an extremely simple way- from my experience violence begets violence.

You're quite right in saying that children aren't all the same and I get that- my question is this though, why can't the way you relate to them be consistent? The Kid has peers that many consider wild, out of control, etc. I haven't had these problems because I don't talk down to them, act dismissive, or fail to follow through with what I say. My word is my bond with them and they appreciate it. These are key to dealing with kids- why do so many assume they can treat them as though they are a less significant person than an adult? I guess I just look at it differently than many. It's worked well for me over the years, can't see myself changing it.

I think I'm done with this. I'm actually surprised this thread hasn't been closed down due to the nature of its subject and some of the responses given. Who can figure what is and isn't acceptable- I know I'm baffled.

 

[EveWasFramed]

*sigh* Ive seen nothing but civil debate here and have also seen much more eyebrow-raising topics than this.
Im just glad it's been civil for the most part.

 

[monkeysox]

The first time I spanked my son when he was little, he went to school and two days later hit another child because the other child was equally out of order. He had never done anything like that before.

I never spanked him again, even though I had explained very well to him why I had done so because of what he did wrong.

If we teach children that corrective methods are via physical discipline they repeat what they are taught.

This form of repetition was studied and why countries have now made it illegal to do so.

By my own experience I believe as a Parent the change in law was needed - hitting with canes, spanking etc was an archaic practice and never studied.

Not forcing my opinions on anyone - just sharing them.

My son is not a spoilt brat because I didn't rule him with any physical discipline, neither has he any sociopath tendencies - in fact I am proud of him

Smacking children is a quick fix solution that just causes other problems in my opinion.

 

[Badjedidude]

The first time I spanked my son when he was little, he went to school and two days later hit another child because the other child was equally out of order. He had never done anything like that before.

You can hardly claim that the spanking caused your child to have some sort of revelation that made him believe that hitting is the right way to solve his problems--a mere two days later.

Kids hit each other all the ******* time. And most of the time, it doesn't mean a thing. In fact, it's only in recent years that people starting making such a fuss about kids hitting. Kids play rough, they hit, they fall, they learn that hitting others doesn't work and isn't acceptable; most school teachers take care of that fairly quickly.

Spanking or no, kids generally grow out of that.

I used to fight my brothers all the time. Why? Because we were three boys bursting with testosterone. I was spanked as a child. Do I hit people now? No. Have I physically fought my brothers at any point in the past ten years? No.

I think it's a bit silly to claim that spanking alone can turn someone into a wife beater or a violent person; it's just not true. There is SO MUCH MORE that goes into creating an individual's personality than that. And keep in mind--we're not talking about ABUSE. Statistics do show that children who are abused will grow up to be more likely to abuse. I completely agree.

We're talking about spanking as a disciplinary tool.

And there's no real evidence that spanking will cause a child to grow up to become violent as an adult.

 

[EveWasFramed]

The first time I spanked my son when he was little, he went to school and two days later hit another child because the other child was equally out of order. He had never done anything like that before.

You can hardly claim that the spanking caused your child to have some sort of revelation that made him believe that hitting is the right way to solve his problems--a mere two days later.

Kids hit each other all the ******* time. And most of the time, it doesn't mean a thing. In fact, it's only in recent years that people starting making such a fuss about kids hitting. Kids play rough, they hit, they fall, they learn that hitting others doesn't work and isn't acceptable; most school teachers take care of that fairly quickly.

Spanking or no, kids generally grow out of that.

I used to fight my brothers all the time. Why? Because we were three boys bursting with testosterone. I was spanked as a child. Do I hit people now? No. Have I physically fought my brothers at any point in the past ten years? No.

I think it's a bit silly to claim that spanking alone can turn someone into a wife beater or a violent person; it's just not true. There is SO MUCH MORE that goes into creating an individual's personality than that. And keep in mind--we're not talking about ABUSE. Statistics do show that children who are abused will grow up to be more likely to abuse. I completely agree.

We're talking about spanking as a disciplinary tool.

And there's no real evidence that spanking will cause a child to grow up to become violent as an adult.

I gotta say that I think it depends on the child.
What I went through as a kid would be considered "abuse" by today's standards. I'm not a violent person at all and I didn't pick fights in school, hit other children, etc.
I spank my little one on occasion for specific behaviors (only two) and she RARELY displays those behaviors anymore. She's NEVER hit another child at school or gotten into any kind of trouble. She always gets good marks for conduct in school.
HOWEVER, my nephew recently came to live with us. She has picked up some of his bad behaviors - one of them being hitting when angered. It started out with him getting angry at her and hitting her. After a while, she started hitting back.
I guess my point is, hitting and so forth can certainly be learned from parents who spank, but I do believe that each child is different and will react differently. *shrug*

 

[monkeysox]

That was you Badje - I never hit my siblings or anyone at school.

I was smacked as a child myself, but never agreed with it to be honest.

I think I was able to judge the behaviour of my own childs sudden change of behaviour !

I was respectful in my post - can some of you be respectful in pulling others apart please.

You don't have to agree, but don't TELL me how to THINK

 

[Lonely in BC]

I strongly suspect that the various advocates of spanking/smacking/slapping have their own "scorecard" (for lack of a better word) as to what acceptable vs. nonacceptable punishment is. I've seen people grab their terrified child in a store, turn them over knee or twist them around in an extremely aggressive fashion and lay hand to bottom or wherever a choice striking location presents itself. I've witnessed the one-two smack on the bottom, slapping hands, faces, etc.- it seemed to me that these situations were not the actions of someone in a completely rational frame of mind- their expressions and tone of voice indicated anger and frustration- was that the time to decide discipline?

At what time does "punishment" cross over to something worse? Two smacks vs. three? A welt ok but bruising isn't? Their scream of terror? Begging you not to hit them? How about your finger marks on your child's arm after grabbing them in frustration? Do these things even register or is that need to be physically assertive so necessary that your child's pride or sense of worth is so easy to compromise....

I'll continue to refrain from having my daughter feel like her dignity is worthless. I'll also likely never be able to dampen the contempt I have for someone who figures it's ok to do something to a child that is not acceptable if the same act is inflicted on an adult by another- I believe it would be called assault......

 

[Parabolani]

If a parent has to resort to spanking their child it's because they havnt raised them right in the first place.

 

[Walley]

If a parent has to resort to spanking their child it's because they havnt raised them right in the first place.

i partly agree to that.. but not completely.
all kids will push your buttons and see how far they can test you. its a matter of how we deal with those situations. if a parent ignores them or lets things get too far its becomes harder to handle it.
if we nip things in the bud asap then it wont escalate to a point when strong punishment is needed.

the only spanking i do is to my wife.. and that's because she deserves it

 

[LoneKiller]

If a parent has to resort to spanking their child it's because they havnt raised them right in the first place.

i partly agree to that.. but not completely.
all kids will push your buttons and see how far they can test you. its a matter of how we deal with those situations. if a parent ignores them or lets things get too far its becomes harder to handle it.
if we nip things in the bud asap then it wont escalate to a point when strong punishment is needed.

the only spanking i do is to my wife.. and that's because she deserves it

Will you spank me sexypants?

 

[Lonely in BC]

If a parent has to resort to spanking their child it's because they havnt raised them right in the first place.

i partly agree to that.. but not completely.
all kids will push your buttons and see how far they can test you. its a matter of how we deal with those situations. if a parent ignores them or lets things get too far its becomes harder to handle it.
if we nip things in the bud asap then it wont escalate to a point when strong punishment is needed.

the only spanking i do is to my wife.. and that's because she deserves it

Will you spank me sexypants?

CHEATER....you're shameless....

 

[LoneKiller]

If a parent has to resort to spanking their child it's because they havnt raised them right in the first place.

i partly agree to that.. but not completely.
all kids will push your buttons and see how far they can test you. its a matter of how we deal with those situations. if a parent ignores them or lets things get too far its becomes harder to handle it.
if we nip things in the bud asap then it wont escalate to a point when strong punishment is needed.

the only spanking i do is to my wife.. and that's because she deserves it

Will you spank me sexypants?

CHEATER....you're shameless....

I've been a bad boy BC. Spank me.

 

[Badjedidude]

That was you Badje - I never hit my siblings or anyone at school.

I was smacked as a child myself, but never agreed with it to be honest.

I think I was able to judge the behaviour of my own childs sudden change of behaviour !

I was respectful in my post - can some of you be respectful in pulling others apart please.

You don't have to agree, but don't TELL me how to THINK

Oh, calm the hell down. I never once "told you what to think," or suggested that you were stupid for having your own beliefs on the subject. If you can't take a little bit of opposing argument, then kindly don't join the conversation.

My point here is that by assuming that spanking DIRECTLY impacts a child's perceptions of violence is silly.

Why don't we give our children some agency? Let's step back and understand that they eventually grow up and learn to define themselves; create their own personality. And only SOME of that comes from the things that parents have done (good or bad) to them.

It's going too far to say that spanking directly and solely impacts the level of violence that a child will display in life.

In fact, the most violent kids that I've ever personally known were spoiled brats who were rarely punished at all, let alone spanked.

So maybe in the grand scheme of things, spanking isn't such a horrid idea, is it?

Again... we're not talking about abuse. We're talking about a level-headed parent administering a few swats to the behind, accompanied by a stern talking-to.

 

[Rayri]

i got spankings when i was a kid. But slapping is too much. And as always, spare the rod, spoil the child !

 

[Badjedidude]

But slapping is too much.

I agree. Slapping a child's face is wrong.

 

[LoneKiller]

That was you Badje - I never hit my siblings or anyone at school.

I was smacked as a child myself, but never agreed with it to be honest.

I think I was able to judge the behaviour of my own childs sudden change of behaviour !

I was respectful in my post - can some of you be respectful in pulling others apart please.

You don't have to agree, but don't TELL me how to THINK

Oh, calm the hell down. I never once "told you what to think," or suggested that you were stupid for having your own beliefs on the subject. If you can't take a little bit of opposing argument, then kindly don't join the conversation.

My point here is that by assuming that spanking DIRECTLY impacts a child's perceptions of violence is silly.

Why don't we give our children some agency? Let's step back and understand that they eventually grow up and learn to define themselves; create their own personality. And only SOME of that comes from the things that parents have done (good or bad) to them.

It's going too far to say that spanking directly and solely impacts the level of violence that a child will display in life.

In fact, the most violent kids that I've ever personally known were spoiled brats who were rarely punished at all, let alone spanked.

So maybe in the grand scheme of things, spanking isn't such a horrid idea, is it?

Again... we're not talking about abuse. We're talking about a level-headed parent administering a few swats to the behind, accompanied by a stern talking-to.

You two calm down or the both of you will get a spanking!

 

[Walley]

My point here is that by assuming that spanking DIRECTLY impacts a child's perceptions of violence is silly

i think that is where you are feeling resistence to your concepts. because assuming that spanking does NOT impact a childs perception of violence is more than silly. for lack of a better word.
you may feel that in your expirience kids that had no punishment ended up more violent.. well in my expiriences, i have seen kids with strict fathers who spanked at the drop of a hat (but not to cross the line of legal abuse) and that kid turned into one of the worst bullies in my school.

and btw, if you don't want tension or have it start to turn into name calling then you should avoid comments like: Oh, calm the hell down.
that will only inspire agression. it does to me for sure anyways.

we're not talking about abuse you say? by who is the judge on what is and what isnt abuse? do you know that you can be charged with assault without ever actually laying a hand on another person? intimidation is grounds for an assauly charge on it's own.
this is another ediculous debate thread to have here because the laws in various regions of the world are not consistent and none of us will change other peoples opinions on the matter.

 

[Badjedidude]

i think that is where you are feeling resistence to your concepts. because assuming that spanking does NOT impact a childs perception of violence is more than silly. for lack of a better word.
you may feel that in your expirience kids that had no punishment ended up more violent.. well in my expiriences, i have seen kids with strict fathers who spanked at the drop of a hat (but not to cross the line of legal abuse) and that kid turned into one of the worst bullies in my school.

Spanking "at the drop of a hat" sure sounds a hell of a lot like misuse of the disciplinary tool to me.

and btw, if you don't want tension or have it start to turn into name calling then you should avoid comments like: Oh, calm the hell down.
that will only inspire agression. it does to me for sure anyways.

Notice that I didn't call names.

If people can't stand aggressively stated arguments, then why even bother getting involved in the debate?

Am I forceful in my approach? You bet.

That's because I believe what I'm saying and I stand behind it. Don't confuse that with bickering or arrogance.

we're not talking about abuse you say? by who is the judge on what is and what isnt abuse? do you know that you can be charged with assault without ever actually laying a hand on another person? intimidation is grounds for an assauly charge on it's own.
this is another ediculous debate thread to have here because the laws in various regions of the world are not consistent and none of us will change other peoples opinions on the matter.

I'd say that determining if a child has been abused in the context of spanking would be a matter of common sense. Really... is it THAT hard to tell if someone's abusing someone? Let's not overthink this, alright?

 

[Poguesy]

I used to spank myself 'cause i enjoyed it.