Why Do Good Women Stay With Bad Men?(Seriously)

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

I know, it's ridiculous.

 

[Sci-Fi]

I don't like either of them. From what I heard Rihanna wasn't such an innocent little peach herself. There were reports that she hit him too a few times. Neither were very good at controlling their anger. He took it way too far and should have gotten a more sever punishment. It really urkes me when these celebrities get off with a slap on the wrist. Paris Hilton, Lindsay Lohan, grant you the former has been behaving herself more. Same with Halle Berry, can't stand that woman, she's had multiple hit and runs and gotten off with a mere slap on the wrist. It's disgusting that these people can just buy their way out of trouble. They need to start treating them like everyone else, isn't that what they all bitch about wanting anyway? We always hear how celebrities are just people like us, how come they aren't treated that way then? Why do we have such a messed up system where the rich and famous can do whatever they want and get away with it? It disgusts me.

/rant

 

[LoneKiller]

I don't like either of them. From what I heard Rihanna wasn't such an innocent little peach herself. There were reports that she hit him too a few times. Neither were very good at controlling their anger. He took it way too far and should have gotten a more sever punishment. It really urkes me when these celebrities get off with a slap on the wrist. Paris Hilton, Lindsay Lohan, grant you the former has been behaving herself more. Same with Halle Berry, can't stand that woman, she's had multiple hit and runs and gotten off with a mere slap on the wrist. It's disgusting that these people can just buy their way out of trouble. They need to start treating them like everyone else, isn't that what they all bitch about wanting anyway? We always hear how celebrities are just people like us, how come they aren't treated that way then? Why do we have such a messed up system where the rich and famous can do whatever they want and get away with it? It disgusts me.

/rant

I agree with you on this one Sci-Fi. Celebs like to
think that they have carte blanche to do whatever they want. Sadly, they have money, and these days, money is the universal language. Not English.

 

[jjam]

Chris brown was charged, serving 5 years probation and was allowed back at the grammy's 2 nights ago.

I don't think Chris Brown is a bad guy.
I think he's rich, has good looks, can dance and has a lot of women coming at him for those reasons. I think he is enjoying the life of a rock star. As far as hitting that woman goes, I think it's very possible she deserved it. I don't know the story in detail so I wouldn't judge him over it.

So is a poor, less attractive person who can't dance and doesn't have women "coming at him", a bad person? And since when has violence that's not in self-defense ever been excusable?
Wow... Just wow...

To answer the bolded part, no. I didn't say that and I'm sorry if that's where your reading comprehension took you.

Look, just as people can THINK Chris Brown is a bad guy, I can THINK he isn't.

As for the second part of your post, again, I don't KNOW the story. I don't THINK you all know the story, and I don't trust that the MEDIA knew the whole story. But even IF that is the story, NONE of us are perfect. If this man has a major history of beating women, then show me. But if he struck a woman, hasn't a history of doing it, came out publicly to apologize, and is ACTING truly sorry over his misbehavior, then that's about as good as a human being can do given our imperfections. That is unless you're one of those who thinks once a bad guy, always a bad guy...

 

[DesertWolf]

Chris brown was charged, serving 5 years probation and was allowed back at the grammy's 2 nights ago.

I don't think Chris Brown is a bad guy.
I think he's rich, has good looks, can dance and has a lot of women coming at him for those reasons. I think he is enjoying the life of a rock star. As far as hitting that woman goes, I think it's very possible she deserved it. I don't know the story in detail so I wouldn't judge him over it.

So is a poor, less attractive person who can't dance and doesn't have women "coming at him", a bad person? And since when has violence that's not in self-defense ever been excusable?
Wow... Just wow...

To answer the bolded part, no. I didn't say that and I'm sorry if that's where your reading comprehension took you.

Look, just as people can THINK Chris Brown is a bad guy, I can THINK he isn't.

As for the second part of your post, again, I don't KNOW the story. I don't THINK you all know the story, and I don't trust that the MEDIA knew the whole story. But even IF that is the story, NONE of us are perfect. If this man has a major history of beating women, then show me. But if he struck a woman, hasn't a history of doing it, came out publicly to apologize, and is ACTING truly sorry over his misbehavior, then that's about as good as a human being can do given our imperfections. That is unless you're one of those who thinks once a bad guy, always a bad guy...

I guess I misinterpreted what you wrote: I thought you were explaining why you thought he wasn't a bad guy by stating that he's rich, etc. You have a point about the media; It doesn't exactly have a good record of being reliable and unbiased. I also have to agree that a few bad actions don't necessarily constitute a bad person. My apologies for the misunderstanding.

 

[TheMaul]

All the best answers to the original question were posted, however I wanted to contribute something that I thought of while reading through.

Stepping outside the bounds of physical abuse, which is really something I've never seen intelligent people experience...sorry if that offends anyone, but in my own experience its usually the overly beefcake ******s with massive egos who beat on their ditz with self-esteem issues. Maybe I've just grown up in a limited sphere of the world, but I've yet to see many cases of smart people or people who are more "stable" in terms of ******* life skills end up in those situations.

I have a theory that sensitive men (a minority, frowned upon stereotypically by both genders) are in fact MORE prone to emotional abuse than women are because as a man, it isn't considered to be normal or cool to talk about your feelings, or what is eating at you inside. Where as women find it much easier to rely on their friends or anyone who will listen, and hence why break-ups are always secretly harder on these sorts of men than women.

 

[Felix]

I have a theory that sensitive men (a minority, frowned upon stereotypically by both genders) are in fact MORE prone to emotional abuse than women are because as a man, it isn't considered to be normal or cool to talk about your feelings, or what is eating at you inside. Where as women find it much easier to rely on their friends or anyone who will listen, and hence why break-ups are always secretly harder on these sorts of men than women.

That theory sounds quite accurate but I think things are slowly changing and men who have close friends can talk about those things.

 

[kamya]

Also I think when people get married a lot of times their social networks kind of die off. That is sometimes how the abuse starts.

 

[jjam]

Oh, it's cool, man!
No hard feelings, I hope. We're all just throwing around opinions.

 

[frey12]

We always hear how celebrities are just people like us, how come they aren't treated that way then? Why do we have such a messed up system where the rich and famous can do whatever they want and get away with it? It disgusts me.

/rant

The problem with the framing of how you talk about this. Is you think the solution to the justice system is to make it as unjust as it is for poor people. When everyone poor, and middle class should have justice.

You are talking about the two tiered justice system which is what the U.S. has. The rich have a different style of justice then the poor and middle class do. The solution is not to make things worse for those who are rich and powerful because that is neither plausible or possible. To make the justice system fair for us(poor/middle) is plausible albeit hard. This is through simple things like going through city council meetings, and setting up community organizing.

Chris brown was charged, serving 5 years probation and was allowed back at the grammy's 2 nights ago.

I don't think Chris Brown is a bad guy.
I think he's rich, has good looks, can dance and has a lot of women coming at him for those reasons. I think he is enjoying the life of a rock star. As far as hitting that woman goes, I think it's very possible she deserved it. I don't know the story in detail so I wouldn't judge him over it.

So is a poor, less attractive person who can't dance and doesn't have women "coming at him", a bad person? And since when has violence that's not in self-defense ever been excusable?
Wow... Just wow...

To answer the bolded part, no. I didn't say that and I'm sorry if that's where your reading comprehension took you.

Look, just as people can THINK Chris Brown is a bad guy, I can THINK he isn't.

As for the second part of your post, again, I don't KNOW the story. I don't THINK you all know the story, and I don't trust that the MEDIA knew the whole story. But even IF that is the story, NONE of us are perfect. If this man has a major history of beating women, then show me. But if he struck a woman, hasn't a history of doing it, came out publicly to apologize, and is ACTING truly sorry over his misbehavior, then that's about as good as a human being can do given our imperfections. That is unless you're one of those who thinks once a bad guy, always a bad guy...

http://hellogiggles.com/im-not-okay...ng-at-the-grammys-and-im-not-sure-why-you-are

JJAM I think you should read this. It at least provides a fair rather pissed off, but some what eloquent reason for why Chris Browns behavior was unacceptable. It also provides pictures of Rihanna's face if you wanna look. I could care less about you feeling guilty. This is about giving you another point of view.

 

[jjam]

Thanks, but I think I'll pass. It's not that I'm uninterested in another perspective, it's just that I suspect that it's probably someone who feels Chris should be put on a cross, that the world should feel that way about it, and can't even share with his/her readers a FULL story that they'd be willing to bet with their lives is the full and true story in that tall glass of vitriol. Believe me, I already know of that kind of point of view. I try not to have it by default as it seems most women and even men do, which is unfortunate, considering this default pov is like an attack on us. The best I can do is remind myself that I don't know all of the story and reserve judgement. Nevertheless, when this story first came out, I TOO was one who immediately blamed Chris Brown. I didn't know jack about the whole story but I was thinking "oh, **** this piece of **** guy!" That's how we are all wired now, isn't it?

And again, even AFTER the truth of the story comes. Even IF Chris is THE BAD GUY and Rhianna is Princess Innocent, am I supposed to feel redemption is out of the question for him? Am I supposed to hate him? Dislike him for life? Heck, I don't even like the guy's work and I don't know him personally. But I know that I have done some things in the past that I wouldn't want someone to expect of me for the rest of my life, and think the worst of me for.


If you want to copy and paste it here, though, I might reconsider.

 

[VanillaCreme]

Also I think when people get married a lot of times their social networks kind of die off. That is sometimes how the abuse starts.

That is true, however, sometimes it's the partner bringing their spouse out of their territory. You hear of a lot of stories where the abused person has no where to go or no one to go to because their spouse has taken them away from what they know. And that's when they can begin the cycle and whatnot.

 

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

Thanks, but I think I'll pass. It's not that I'm uninterested in another perspective, it's just that I suspect that it's probably someone who feels Chris should be put on a cross, that the world should feel that way about it, and can't even share with his/her readers a FULL story that they'd be willing to bet with their lives is the full and true story in that tall glass of vitriol. Believe me, I already know of that kind of point of view. I try not to have it by default as it seems most women and even men do, which is unfortunate, considering this default pov is like an attack on us. The best I can do is remind myself that I don't know all of the story and reserve judgement. Nevertheless, when this story first came out, I TOO was one who immediately blamed Chris Brown. I didn't know jack about the whole story but I was thinking "oh, **** this piece of **** guy!" That's how we are all wired now, isn't it?

And again, even AFTER the truth of the story comes. Even IF Chris is THE BAD GUY and Rhianna is Princess Innocent, am I supposed to feel redemption is out of the question for him? Am I supposed to hate him? Dislike him for life? Heck, I don't even like the guy's work and I don't know him personally. But I know that I have done some things in the past that I wouldn't want someone to expect of me for the rest of my life, and think the worst of me for.


If you want to copy and paste it here, though, I might reconsider.

Are. You. Serious??!

This is why domestic violence is allowed, because people like you are so easily ready to sweep it under the rug.

Listen to me. NOBODY deserves to be hit. Man, or woman. If you can't get that through your head, you don't deserve to be posting in a thread on domestic violence, because you are part of the problem, not the solution.

 

[Sci-Fi]

We always hear how celebrities are just people like us, how come they aren't treated that way then? Why do we have such a messed up system where the rich and famous can do whatever they want and get away with it? It disgusts me.

/rant

The problem with the framing of how you talk about this. Is you think the solution to the justice system is to make it as unjust as it is for poor people. When everyone poor, and middle class should have justice.

You are talking about the two tiered justice system which is what the U.S. has. The rich have a different style of justice then the poor and middle class do. The solution is not to make things worse for those who are rich and powerful because that is neither plausible or possible. To make the justice system fair for us(poor/middle) is plausible albeit hard. This is through simple things like going through city council meetings, and setting up community organizing.

I never once mentioned anything about poor people, so I have no idea where you are getting that from. All I am saying is that the rich and famous need to have the same treatment as everyone else. It shouldn't matter what your status, you do the crime you do the time.

 

[oopsiedoop]

I guess I misinterpreted what you wrote: I thought you were explaining why you thought he wasn't a bad guy by stating that he's rich, etc. You have a point about the media; It doesn't exactly have a good record of being reliable and unbiased. I also have to agree that a few bad actions don't necessarily constitute a bad person. My apologies for the misunderstanding.

I still think that's what he meant, because that's what he's still saying and said. Regarding someone not being a bad person because of one thing, you know, it counts. It all counts. Are you saying that someone who would never do this isn't better? Wrong. And, it also depends on what. We all know that Hitler liked animals. Does that make him a good person? Chris Brown is good looking and a good enough entertainer (I suppose). He is not a good person. People are saying the media doesn't know but then what do they know about him other than those superficial things? What we know is he punched a woman in the face. What could justify that?

I can't follow the conversation any more because outside of this that I could at least respond to the stuff that's being said is so incredible, well not incredible because that's the point, this is how people think and it's got to be changed, but I can't find another word for points of view that are I think beyond the scope of a forum to address because it would just descend into empty fights with morons and my energy is better spent elsewhere. That's just how I feel at the moment and if I have more energy I might change my mind. I'm glad there's people who still have the stomach for it. There are people whose opinions I differ with who I think are only mistaken and I'll respond, and even though it's all grist for the mill of female powerlessness there are people whose thinking amounts to being the actual perpetrators and what can you say to a moron who has no mind? They're the ones who need force.

 

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

I basically just don't see how you can justify doing to a woman what Chris Brown did to Rhianna, especially when she's petite and he's a muscular dude.

It makes him a chicken ****, is what it makes him. If he was arrested for beating up another muscular dude, that would be one thing.

And do I need to justify that poster's misogyny? She deserved it, for throwing his keys out the window, and for calling him on cheating on her? Wow.

 

[oopsiedoop]

Listen to me. NOBODY deserves to be hit. Man, or woman.

Some people do. Chris Brown does. He can be enlightened afterwards.

If a woman were to try to punch a guy's face in though she could easily be stopped by him.

---

I don't believe in punishing all men for the actions of a few.

It's not punishment to men to take away their freedom to do what they want to women. It's justice.

Taking justice into our own hands is exactly what needs to happen. Out of men's, and into ours.

 

[Hoffy]

Why don't we just do this to ever one (un)

[video=youtube]

 

[blackdot]

If a woman were to try to punch a guy's face in though she could easily be stopped by him.

---

---

Not necessarily true. There are women that are stronger than some men.

 

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

I remember that "Goodbye Earl" song. I actually used to own that album.

I think, instead of "men vs. women" debates on here, we should stop hating the opposite gender, and try to understand how to stop these kinds of things from happening.