What men vs what women want

[Regumika]

my poor thread... =(

But they have to see things from our point of view as well.

No I don't and here's why: I don't expect anyone but ME to raise my child. I had her and she is my responsibility. Since her dad only sees her once a year and not on a daily basis, her care falls to me and me only. I wouldnt expect someone I'm dating to play dad to my child.

would you expect your future partner to play dad to your child? not now, but once you two are partners. I am going to assume that LearningInto is talking about scenarios of committed relationship, not just dating. If it was the norm to play dad/mom while dating.. that child could end up with lots of 'dads' and 'moms' depending on how many people the single parent dates.

 

[VanillaCreme]

Eve said she didn't expect anyone else to, meaning no one else should or has to but her. However, I would believe that it would be okay if someone else became close to their partner's kids. That's not to say they should definitely raise them though. If I had a baby with Jeremy, but ended up with someone else, I would certainly hope the dude would at least like my child, and if he didn't, then he'd have to go.

 

[WildernessWildChild]

poor man with a bad life, so? find that perfect girl who will take care... oh wait, she wouldnt want a guy like him. he has issues. she can do so much better.

Maybe I'm reading this wrong but I often thought that females are as able to accept a guy with issues as one without. I've seen (and been in to be honest) relationships where the lady took a chance on a guy who's somewhat down and out/less desirable/has issues (what ever label works for you), encouraged the strengths and abilities he has, and ended up making his life change for the better. Despite no longer being with the person who took on my "issues" and improving my life I'm still very appreciative of that time and we maintain an otherwise good relationship.

It seems like your thread has kind of gone beyond your original post Regumika, nothing unusual on ALL since we all think kind of differently- be encouraged that your o.p. has encouraged so much thought, debate, and somewhat heated discussion.

Reading the posts about children and the effect on relationship compatibility has been kind of interesting. I'm personally not bothered by being passed up on due to my having a daughter (for clarifications sake, I'm not a single Dad but I do spend the majority of my free time with my daughter), I wouldn't want to be with someone who didn't appreciate the importance of her in my life. If I met someone with kids I'd likely be fine with it provided there was no animosity between the former partners that would spill over to creating problems with their kids (the last thing I'd want to be involved in is an angry parent situation, they're so ugly). Heck, I'd even consider a relationship with someone who wanted a child of their own (highly unlikely though since I'm mid-forties).

What would I want....I'm not really hung up on looks, social status, education or wealth. None of us really come problem or issue free either so there's no thought of finding the perfect person. I can't even say I'm actively looking looking for anyone as I'm not sure I have anything to offer although I'd explore the possibilities if someone who had an interest in me came along....hmmm, I think I'm getting sidetracked here.

I guess my input probably isn't going to help much since I don't really have a checklist due to not looking. I'll get back to you if that changes

 

[ardour]

Women are programmed to be pickier.....

Partly genetic, due to the need for a provider and personal safety for them and their potential offspring (wanting to avoid an abusive partner), partly because of the pampered princess mentality women are brought up with so that any weakness in a man is considered a deal-breaker.

They can't stand being disappointed about anything; instead of a man as a real human being they want a manikin with all the right characteristics.

It amazes me how women view their desires and personal preferences (usually around appearance) as a perfect judge of a man's character. There's no disconnect between emotion and judgement.

 

[LonelyLola]

It kind of makes me sick how much you men generalize what women want, categorizing us as selfish, "pampered princess" types. Do you know how many women there are in the world? Do you know how many of us ARE NOT just looking for a brash male to take care of us?

From and evolutionary standpoint, yes, women are 'programmed' to be pickier, because without the support of a male raising offspring was so much more difficult. You know what tho? We aren't just animals- we have thoughts and awareness and conciousness.

Most of the women I know, which is a lot. Not just my friends, but the girls I go to university with, the women I work with, members of thensubreddits I subscribe toon reddit- these women want partners. They want someone who yes, is successful at life, but that doesn't mean rich or super hot, or whatever stereotypes you believe women need from men. They want someone who will be supportive, who will treat them with respect, and who they connect with.

Anyway, until you realize that each woman you meet is an individual, with their own motives and emotions, you probably want have the success you want. Cme on guys, women aren't all just looking for a mate. Some just want a friend.

 

[painter's radio]

you men

:club:

 

[WildernessWildChild]

It kind of makes me sick how much you men generalize what women want, categorizing us as selfish, "pampered princess" types. Do you know how many women there are in the world? Do you know how many of us ARE NOT just looking for a brash male to take care of us?

From and evolutionary standpoint, yes, women are 'programmed' to be pickier, because without the support of a male raising offspring was so much more difficult. You know what tho? We aren't just animals- we have thoughts and awareness and conciousness.

Most of the women I know, which is a lot. Not just my friends, but the girls I go to university with, the women I work with, members of thensubreddits I subscribe toon reddit- these women want partners. They want someone who yes, is successful at life, but that doesn't mean rich or super hot, or whatever stereotypes you believe women need from men. They want someone who will be supportive, who will treat them with respect, and who they connect with.

Anyway, until you realize that each woman you meet is an individual, with their own motives and emotions, you probably want have the success you want. Cme on guys, women aren't all just looking for a mate. Some just want a friend.

Didn't this post just generalize men?

 

[LonelyLola]

No, I know lots of men who don't think like the posts from men in this thread.


When I said "you men" I meant the men who replied to this thread, using terms that generalize women. I was not referring to all men, which is what many of the posts here did. Hence the using "you".

I did generalize about what many women want, based on my own circle of experience, which is not just a small circle of friends but includes my workplaces, my school, the sexual health Center I run at school, and my friends/family.

 

[WildernessWildChild]

No, I know lots of men who don't think like the posts from men in this thread.


When I said "you men" I meant the men who replied to this thread, using terms that generalize women. I was not referring to all men, which is what many of the posts here did. Hence the using "you".

I did generalize about what many women want, based on my own circle of experience, which is not just a small circle of friends but includes my workplaces, my school, the sexual health Center I run at school, and my friends/family.

Thanks for clearing that up Double L, I read it as men in general

 

[LonelyLola]

Which I can see why, phrasing! Lol.

But I really did mean in specific to this thread.

 

[ardour]

that was part tongue-in-cheek

 

[EveWasFramed]

would you expect your future partner to play dad to your child? not now, but once you two are partners. I am going to assume that LearningInto is talking about scenarios of committed relationship, not just dating. If it was the norm to play dad/mom while dating.. that child could end up with lots of 'dads' and 'moms' depending on how many people the single parent dates.

I meant in a serious relationship as well. And no, I'd never expect anyone but her father to be "dad" to her. If I met a guy who was interested in some sort of role in her life because he genuinely cared about her, then that's awesome too.

---

Women are programmed to be pickier.....

partly because of the pampered princess mentality women are brought up with

What planet are you from? Because I don't think it's Earth.
Pampered princess mentallity I (women) was brought up with?
NOTHING could less true.

 

[ardour]

This will be interpreted as misogynist by some people.

It's the societal biased perception around the infallibility of women's emotional responses. Therein lies privilege.

That means a lot of merely socially awkward guys get judged as boring, worthless or worse still, creepy because women would rather go by intuition than bother to get to know them and judge them fairly. No-one questions it.

It also seems that men get dropped for reasons they would never drop a woman for - occasional emotional weakness, occasional aloofness or lack of confidence. At the snap of fingers the 'chemistry' (ie. fantasy) is gone for women and the relationship in their eyes irrecoverably damaged.

Of course a lot of women are fair and have reasonable expectations, and I look on this from an outside perspective.

 

[Badjedidude]

This will be interpreted as misogynist by some people.

Then you might want to consider the possibility that it could be misogynistic.

Women are programmed to be pickier.....

partly because of the pampered princess mentality women are brought up with

Just for the sake of argument: Historically speaking, women would be more likely to be programmed to believe that they are property. We're talking thousands of years of societal structure largely tending to operate on that premise.

For what it's worth...

No amount of social "programming" is enough to keep people from being able to overcome that same programming. People aren't computers. We can choose to grow out of whatever beliefs or attitudes we've acquired from our environments.

 

[ardour]

This will be interpreted as misogynist by some people.

Then you might want to consider the possibility that it could be misogynistic.

Women (often rightly) criticise men all the time for being primarily into looks and sex.

I'm simply stating what I see as women's own sometimes obnoxious attitudes towards men.

It's more obvious with women from comfortable backgrounds because liberal middle-class parents don't know how to parent girls. Girls are more complex than boys. So they grow up with less general respect for others, which in relationships translates into being more likely to believe that how they feel about another IS that person. A lot of women trust their emotions completely it seems, never second guessing them. I see that as a failing, just as men have failings.

 

[Badjedidude]

Girls are more complex than boys

No they aren't. That's sex-bias on your part. You only think women are more complex because you're a man and you don't fully understand women.

I'd say that both sexes are the same in complexity. And I say that fully aware that you haven't even defined what you mean by "complexity."

I think the real problem here is that you're being far too general in describing all women as having the attributes you're proposing. It sounds like a language quibble, but try adding these words the next time you're talking about whatever traits you feel that women possess:

"Some"
"Many"
"Generally"

Because it's one thing to make a claim that some women (or even many women) exhibit a particular attitude toward men (or whatever it is you're asserting)... it's another thing entirely to say that women (or all women) are like that. And vice versa for men.

 

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

Okay, let me play out two different scenarios.

A.) I meet a girl, we hit it off, and she takes me home and introduces me to her child. I am expected to babysit, be a replacement dad, and I get basically nothing out of the relationship, but she gets a replacement dad for her kid. Oh, and the kid loves it, but I grow weary.
B.) I meet a girl, we hit it off, and after dating for a couple weeks, she introduces me to her kid. We take it slow, there is no pressure, and I am not expected to win the kid over. I end up having a good relationship with him/her, I fall in love with their mom, and there is sex and everything that a relationship involves.

Which one is more likely to make me stick around?

I am not opposed to dating someone who has kids. I love kids. I love my nieces and nephews. Sometimes I can't stand being around kids, though, and need to be alone...and I pretty much had to talk that into their heads, that their uncle needs space. When I want them around, I'll ask for them...otherwise, go ask your mother.

It's hard living with 5 kids who are related to you, but are not your children...and I imagine it would be even more difficult trying to fit the dad role, when you have limited relationship experience. Please don't fault me for being weary about dating someone with kids. I don't hate you or your kids, or think that children are a mistake...I just think it is a mistake for me to get involved in something that might not work out, and not only will the kids be hurt, and you will be hurt, but I will be hurt as well. I want to prevent that.

(Here I am talking like I actually do go out and date...this is what every 30 year old male virgin has to face, and why it is so hard to break into dating in the first place!)

 

[ardour]

Girls are more complex than boys

No they aren't. That's sex-bias on your part. You only think women are more complex because you're a man and you don't fully understand women.

I'd say that both sexes are the same in complexity. And I say that fully aware that you haven't even defined what you mean by "complexity."

More mature for their age is what I meant.

I think the real problem here is that you're being far too general in describing all women as having the attributes you're proposing. It sounds like a language quibble, but try adding these words the next time you're talking about whatever traits you feel that women possess:

"Some"
"Many"
"Generally"

You'll find that I have at certain points, just not as much as could have or need to (out of laziness)

 

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

Some men can be very mature. Some women can be very immature.

My sister is 33, and she acts like a 15 year old sometimes. She's into Hello Kitty and things like Sweet Brown. It's easy to joke and laugh with her, but even her kids have noticed that she acts closer to their age than to almost a 40 year old.

 

[VanillaCreme]

I'm sorry, Muse, but you seem to want to stick a label on many women based on not only what you feel or think, but your sister. I'm sure you do know some of the struggles that single mothers go through based upon being around your sister, but not all situations are like hers. You can't know all about it because your sister's also one.

That'd be like me claiming to know all about Rent-A-Center because my brother used to work there. No, I don't know all about it. I know a few things that the average person wouldn't know, but not all.